Cummins Engine

[LowGear]

I was looking for an antique section in the engine list and then realized most of the engines listed are in fact antiques.  So; If I owned a Dodge diesel this would be a mandatory accessory for the garage. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-GsINYNuf8&t=1s

Casey

[glort]

Sure makes a Lister look simple and straightforward.
I think anything slow and long stroke is antique these days. Don't know of any modern small engine that's not a screamer.

I was only thinking the other day, I wonder how many of these old engines are still going tot he tip/ scrappy's?  People must pass on and the families don't know/ want to know what these tings are and just get rid of them.  Probably many are still in running or easily restoreable condition but people don't know their scarcity and value and they have no value to them.

If we think these treasures are hard to find now, just wait 20 years.... not that a lot of us will still be around then or give a damn much if we are!   
Not that I have much of significance but I know all mine will probably get cleared out by the fastest means possible.

[mobile_bob]

an old dude here in town, who passed on about 4 years ago now, had over 200 stationary engine's of all makes and models typical of the region and of ag or farm use.

his widow contacted an auctioneer who specializes in this sort of thing, or supposedly was supposed to be.  the thinking was they would be better at getting the word out to a broader group of buyers.

the day of the auction i would be surprised if there were 5 guys from out of area, and the average engine sold for ~275 bucks.

i bought an 8 hp witte on a home built trailer, with 4 spoked ag wheels that i just could not see letting go for 275 dollars so i bid 300 and got it.

it has the twin groove generator flywheel on it, and the history of the thing was it was once a genset, and the guy sold the genhead and switch gear for scrap and broke off the rear part of the base casting on his way to breaking up the rest when the deceased fellow saved it from a certain death and gave the idiot 30 bucks to take it home with him.

it starts and runs beautifully,  something i do just to stand back and watch the old girl run.

i needed it like another hole in the head, but wow, i couldn't let it go.

i also bought a petter 7hp for 60 bucks which i think was on a light bar in its early life.  it is electric start and runs perfectly too.

the problem with this stuff is the old guys that appreciate these engines are ... well "old" and when they are gone the younger guys don't have any real need or attraction to some old oily/smelly/nasty/earth destroying/iceburg melting peace of cast iron.  most of the younger guys would think they would be doing the planet a service to buy one at auction just to take it to a scrapper and feel good about saving the ozone or whatever they tell themselves this week.

right now anvils are hot, along with all sorts of blacksmithing stuff, mainly because of the blacksmith/knife building shows on tv, and younger guys all thinking they will make a living doing such stuff... hopefully they will protect what is left of that stuff, but when the day comes they figure out they are going broke and the kids are hungry they may just scrap everything and get a job writing software or developing some worthless app for the latest smart phone.

i am not overly optimistic for old iron being around for another generation.

maybe it is a good thing we don't get to live for more than the average 76 years or so,  i have a feeling at some point one gets very depressed watching what he worked so hard for going on the scrap heap as no one cares about it anymore.

sorry for the digression

(first one in quite a while)

bob g

[playdiesel]

Bob,
If it helps engines have fared far better than old tractors, at least in these parts. Guys who resurrected the more common 30s,40s and 50s farm tractors are watching them sell for the price of the tires, or less. Consignment auction this past week I had a heck of a time keeping my hands in my pockets as I watched tractor after tractor not break $1000, a VERY nicely restored F-20 farmall brought $850, An Allis B with belly mower ready to cut the lawn $400, H Farmall running and ready to use, $500 and on and on,,,,  Had a few engines there and they all brought respectable money.  There a a LOT of collectors selling out now, big time collectors and the market is absolutely flooded with both engines and tractors. If not well advertised and timed things are going to sell cheap.

[glort]

the problem with this stuff is the old guys that appreciate these engines are ... well "old" and when they are gone the younger guys don't have any real need or attraction to some old oily/smelly/nasty/earth destroying/iceburg melting peace of cast iron.  most of the younger guys would think they would be doing the planet a service to buy one at auction just to take it to a scrapper and feel good about saving the ozone or whatever they tell themselves this week.

right now anvils are hot, along with all sorts of blacksmithing stuff, mainly because of the blacksmith/knife building shows on tv, and younger guys all thinking they will make a living doing such stuff... hopefully they will protect what is left of that stuff, but when the day comes they figure out they are going broke and the kids are hungry they may just scrap everything and get a job writing software or developing some worthless app for the latest smart phone.

You are a man after my own heart Bob.
Your sentiments are exactly the same as mine.  I worry for the way the world is going now. There seems to be such an internet/ faceboob mentality that is like a parallel universe where the way people think is just ridiculous and so far detached from the real world it makes me want to puke. 

I am SO Effing sick of all this " Save the planet, Oh no, co2 is the devil, everything has to be green" BULLSHIT I'm going to have a conniption before much longer.  The mrs and I went looking for a Fridge the other day.
Geezuz! $2500 for the one she wants and I look at it and just know the 30-35 yo one we have now that will be relegated to a spare will still be going when this flimsy plastic, corner cutting, energy rated piece of lightweight garbage is long gone.  The sales guy started talking about Co2 emissions.  I held my hand up and quietly said, "If you want to have a hope in hell about selling me something, never mention that bullshit again. I'm here for a fridge, not to have that crap rammed down my throat some more."  Probably thought I was some redneck Bogan, which I am, but I am fed up with that scam and insult to my intelligence.

Just seems to me the priorities are so wrong these days.  My daughter NEVER has the phone out of her hand. I have done all I can to give her a more " Meaningful" aspect of life but I cannot win against the force of what every other kid, ( person from 5 to 55 it seems) is doing.  We just bought a new luxury home in an upmarket acreage estate and the only thing shes concerned about is the " reception".  Should have moved 10 Km further out to make sure there was none! I think these phones are turning several generations into idiots and morons.

We haven't got the blacksmithing shows/ craze here yet, not that I have seen or heard of anyway and I doubt it will take off here much. I think we are too city based for anyone to have the space or be able to make the noise and have a fire, coal, gas or otherwise to do it.  be a wonder if it's not banned because of the greenhouse emissions and burning fossil fuels and other crap. I'm all for this though. It's anti PC, anti Iphone, do something with your hands and become a real man.  Hopefully it puts the lead in a few young blokes pencils again.
Of course that said, the biggest bunch of whingeing, limp wristed, cry baby sooks and pussys on any forum I ever came across was on a blacksmithing forum. Pack  of hypocrites too. One minute carrying on and moaning about all sorts of over the top and far fetched safety crap and then in the next thread telling me that is was perfectly safe to let a 5 Yo use a forge! Ya, right! No conflict there!

I think the dumbing down and taking away of any DIY and outside interested is pretty much pre disposed.  I was looking the other day at a new housing develop,emt where I am going. I am about 60Km from the city centre. There are endless paddocks of cows and horses around within 5 min if that. They are opening up developments out there fast as they can. Unlike the acre i went out there for, this latest release has blocks 312 m2.
I don't know how to convert that but the old 1/4 acre which was standard was 1200m2. My modern acre block is 4000m2.
thing that gets me and I always say is " What do you put in a 4 or 5 bedroom house?  Kids!"  Where are they going to play outside? in 15-20 years, where the fk they all going to park?  No public transport out there to speak of and at best a train line will be going in about 6 Km away in maybe 10 years, probably 20. Still going to have to get out of these Ghettos to get to the train.

There is zero space in these little enclaves and to me it's madness to have so much space around but pack everyone is so tight. there outght to be laws that prevent this and make for minimum block sizes so these places don't become slums.  How anyone is going to do blacksmithing there or do have any interest beyond watching movies and playing video games is beyond me. And the real kicker is they stick huge houses on these tiny blocks so outdoor space is minimal. I looked at one of these estates the other day. All Duplex's and I swear the neighbors could lean out the window and pass the cup of sugar to the next door neighbour through the window.

Young guys in general now wouldn't know how to change their own oil and these places pretty much determine they will never be able to do anything hands on from the start.   There are still the ones right into cars but they are more into 4 Cyl Turbos than a V8 and tuning to them is plugging in the laptop rather than using a timing light and changing the jets in the carb. I do go to a local engine club and I see 2 young guys there, brothers whom are into some old stuff at least. The eldest Drives an armored personnel carrier and has a modified V8 Tractor. Other than that, I often feel like a kid there being in my early 50's and most others looking like they have a good 20 years on me. I was always interested in this stuff, just took me a long time to find it.  I don't think there will be many after me though.

sorry for the digression

(first one in quite a while)

Please digress more. I enjoyed reading your thoughts.

[/quote]

[glort]

Bob,
If it helps engines have fared far better than old tractors, at least in these parts. Guys who resurrected the more common 30s,40s and 50s farm tractors are watching them sell for the price of the tires, or less. Consignment auction this past week I had a heck of a time keeping my hands in my pockets as I watched tractor after tractor not break $1000,

I would suggest this could have a LOT to do with what I was talking about.

No idea with the US but near where I am, all the old 5 and 10 acre lots that were market gardens and Chook farms are being sold for many millions where 10 year ago, you would have bought 10 acres for 1 Million or less.  The million per acre is getting a lot closer to $2m per acre now.  and I am talking land only, not land with a mansion on it.
They are developing them and chopping them up into tiny pieces. I say to people the surveyors now just reach in their pockets, pull out a large handkerchief, mark out the corners and there's your block. I spent over 2 years looking for a place with more than a 2 car garage and I can tell you, they are RARE.  What was once the country and outskirts is fast becoming just a slightly more distant suburb. The suburbs are being chopped up as well. the place I am moving out of now will have townhouses or an apartment block on it. Packing more people into tighter spaces and then wondering why there are social problems.

The local schools all built the best part of if not over 100 years ago now have the once spacious playgrounds filled with demountable buildings which is a catch 22 in less space for more kids.

When I grew up, we lived in surburbia on the old 1/4 acre block.  You could park probably 15 cars 3 wide and 5 deep in the driveway. Dad always had a boat, a couple of cars and a pile of tools and junk in there as well.
There was a box trailer outside for taking stuff to the tip and taking out trail bikes about 15 min to the bike club track. Now a lot of councils won't allow you to have a boat or trailer on the street even though it's legally allowed. they make their own bylaws and somehow get away with enforcing them. Some places won't even allow you to have a boat or trailer on your own front lawn.

I'm sure a lot of people that had things like tractors are now finding there is no space to keep them.  A mate of mine has a restored Muscle car. He lives in a unit with a " 2 car" garage but those 2 cars would have to be the size of a Mini or a smart car to get them in.  He keeps the weekend car at his mothers place in the shed there but wonders what he'll do with it when his mother passes and he and his sister sell the place.  neither wish to live there so maybe the car will have to go too.

I really don't like the direction modern life is going. It's all about profit in squeezing people into little spaces and making them ever more useless.

There is simply no place to put anything these days.

My Uncle has a vintage tractor. No idea what it is but I know it's 1910.  when I settle I might talk to him about it and his '72 dodge truck.  I'd like to put a cummins 6BT in that.  Maybe a 6v53 But the Ciummins would be a lot more livable and have a heap more power.

[LowGear]

The past is to be admired and respected for me but not worshiped.  I try not to mix in too much delusional malarkey but it happens even to the average of us.  Few generations have not believed the world was going to Hell in a hand basket.  Hence, my overview of nostalgia.  "A time and place that never was and never will be."

But we live in the here and now.  The lucky ones will spend some time in the future. 

glort, glort, glort!  As per Elon Musk kinda:  "We're going to run out of petroleum some day and then what are we going to do?  We'll turn to renewable energy sources.  Why continue to rape the earth for an end we know is coming."  I believe he shares his respect for the petroleum market program much the same as you do for people that are experimenting with solar and wind (you know; green-ness brother).

Me.  I think it's interesting that we could easily power the world with solar if we'd just make up our minds and go that way.

Casey

[LowGear]

What's wrong with these people?

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1112058_another-electric-highway-1250-miles-along-australias-coast

There simply is no end.

Casey

[Derb]

Well Fellas - I am sort of a convert. I took a Gen1 Nissan Leaf for a blast the other day and I was expecting it to be pretty damn awful. I was shocked to be honest - this thing went like a rocket! It was comfortable, it had a bit of class (not at all dog-like), had a 100 km range, was fun to drive and was truly a credible alternative to an oil-burner for commuting. The Gen2 is apparently good for 200 kms between charges. This petrol-head got a real buzz out of the thing.

[LowGear]

Welcome Derb

       

[SteveU.]

Green-spinning still eh, Mr Casey?
O.K. Washington State grids have FIVE, 110 car long trains a WEEK coming in from the Dakota's to make steam-electricity. Plus STILL one, sometimes two Nuclear power plants contributing from Hanford. We import seasonal hydro-electricity from Canada/Montana. Sure do import a lot of natural gas for peaking-fill-in generating plants year around. Out state transfer a lot of hydro-electricity down to sunny California.
Oregon got rid of their one Nuke plant. Use a much higher percentage than Washington or California of imported in natural gas for power grids electrical power generation. Oregon DOES transfer in from our in-state generated coal and nuke made grid electricity.
California grids DO still use a three plants Nuke contribution. "Clean" claiming California does have lots and lots of railcar loads of black fossil coal made electricity imported in from the four corners states region.

When my Clark County government removed four pay-for service-center parking spaces and put in four electric car charging stations I asked, "Where is the pay-in slot?" "We supply this free for Federal carbon reduction credits."
Gee. Free transportation energy paid for out of mine and everyone else property taxes!! A few commissioner heads rolled the next election cycle.
When two of my wife's favorite grocery stores put in electric car charging stations I asked management, "Where is the pay-for-use slot?" "We provided this free as a customer service." "O.K. Can I get a free gasoline discount credit too?" Of course not. Told the wifie I would not be shopping at the green-spin-walfare places anymore.
Last February winter breaking down on the Oregon coast one of out favorite stops is The Blue Heron in Tillamook. They now have added a standard electric car charging station and the special Tesla one too. I asked management, "Do we pay for use at the main cash register?" "Oh no. We provide this for free to our good customers." Ah. I'll take it that as a gasoline using customer that we are no longer good-and-welcomed then. They obviously to not need our money to be able to offer up free transportation energy to the special-entitled.

Anymore electric car green spinner out Rural in WA/OR can expect to be very sticky bumper stickered with a, "This car Powered By Nuclear!", "This car Powered By Black-Coal!" "Operator of this car robs electricity from your house!"

Washington State tree-farmer Steve Unruh - DOing something about carbons recycling/reusing

Yeah. Yeah. When I point out welfaring of alternatives to befit a few . . . I get lots of links sent on decades and decades of Big-Oil, Big-Coal, Big-Nuke corporate tax-credits and depletion-allowances welfare.
So what?
Whenever did two Wrongs ever make a Right, eh? Only to me-too whiners.

[Derb]

Is all good Steve - we are charging away largely on hydro, Geothermal, Wind-Farm and  a little bit of Solar here in NZ. Begger-all Coal but a reasonable amount of Natural-Gas. All our charging stations are "Plug and Pay". They seem to be reasonably user-friendly also. I tow a 3 tonne caravan around sucking up good volumes of hydrocarbons in my diesel ute so haven't gone over to the dark side yet. Cheers.

[LowGear]

Don't worry Steve.  The end of the all electric for everything promotion is starting to come to an end.  It should start making it's own way pretty soon.  It's much like the railroads receiving a 20 mile ownership path as they laid track across the old West to make way for progress.  I wonder how much road would have been laid without the 20 mile wide "incentive"? 

You are absolutely correct about we Washingtonians being slackers in renewable energy generation adoption.  The sooner we get our grid green the sooner electrical stuff will be green and that includes juice for air conditioners as well as the production of gasoline which I believe has 4 KW required for every gallon(?).  This greener grid will also shut down the dirtiest power in the world - coal.  China, the new energy leaders of the world, are running from coal as fast as we can build super ports to ship it to a dwindling market.  But not to worry as this rather pure and raw carbon will be very handy in future carbon manipulation manufacturing processes just as petroleum will always make fabulous paint.

Gosh, we spend a lot of money in the Middle East protecting the trade routes for petroleum.  We also tragically squander lives there too.  This is done so petroleum companies can charge you for the gasoline at the pump and do business via accelerated depreciation schemes and the like with the IRS.  Have you seen the documentaries on cancer rates in petroleum processing areas like Louisiana compared to less prosperous or progressive areas?

I've been thinking about buying one of the dirtier automobiles like a Mazda RX-8 and sequestering it's carbon foot print because I only drive a few thousand miles a year.  I wish there was a sporty machine that used diesel.  Then I could have my cake and eat it too.

Aloha,

Casey

Oh, in Hawaii, they charge for paper sacks in some of the grocery stores and you think free sucker bet charging stations are a pain in the market scheme.  Can't write it here.   QFC eat your heart out.

[mobile_bob]

it was a whole lots easier to give away land that didn't belong to the government to the railroads than it is to take money out of the pockets of one hell of a lot of folks that live far below the needed level of income to buy a musk-mobile, or a leaf, or whatever the latest subsidized by the tax payer car on the market.

as i see it the real problem comes down to "how do you pay for it?"  everything from incentives for manufactures, promoters, and above average income earners.

if you can afford an electric car, why the hell should those that are on low fixed incomes, below poverty incomes, disability, etc , subsidize at the register the energy costs for some more well healed customer driving his cute little electric car, all the while having his/her nose in the air looking down from their obviously superior perch on the underlings that are paying for their power to recharge?

in my not so humble opinion, if you can afford an electric vehicle, you should also afford the charger cost at the local market or mall, or wherever you plug in!

what the hell is wrong with that?

i don't even want to go down this path.

bob g

[LowGear]

Everything has a cost.  And the chumps (me to please) at the register more or less pay for everything.  That's just the reality of the market economy or any other economies as far as I know.  Whether you're paying a whopping 10% sales tax here in Washington or 4 plus 8% (state income tax) in Hawaii just about everything is paid for by the people that buy stuff.  OK, the Cayman Islands crowd avoid this bothersome step but the rest of us are payers.

To me the question is "Are we going to better off in 10 years or not".  Will there be less pollution in the air and water or the same or even more?  Have I mentioned the inherent transportation tax - subsidy of setting in traffic 12 minutes a day in older cars where the engine continues to run.  That's one hour a week and well over 40 hours a year or a week's time you donate to inefficient transportation.  And no improvement as a result of your loss/investment of a work weeks time.  "Raise my gas tax?" and "Subsidize mass transit?"?

Coal dust is almost a death ray.  From killing miners cardiovascular systems during harvest, blowing up mines, poisoning the transportation pathways and finally pooping contaminates into the atmosphere during the final conversion process it would still be a downward spiral all over the world had governments not encouraged change to less destructive methods of energy production.

Are our sacrifices going to make for a better tomorrow, the same old stuff or even worse?  Will the men and women that give their lives in the middle east make life any better for us?  Why are you so comfortable with these subsidies that we pay for petroleum and so concerned about the temporary subsidies we let the renewable energy industry earn?