Purchased a Changfa R165 watercooled diesel engine, question about flywheel play

[glort]

Without doubt, this is going to be the most over engineered, over controlled, monitored, cared for, time invested, loved horizontal Diesel engine ever to come out of Chine in it's entire production history!!   

I love it!

I love your control box too.  I was literally just looking on an electrical wholesalers website for a box for a project I'm doing and couldn't find anything suitable.
It's embarrassing that building one somehow didn't cross my mind.  That's a worry I think. I'll take a good hard look at myself and try not to do that again.  Odd really, I'm usualy making stuff I can buy cheaper without the mucking around but I guess we all have our brain fades.


Jess I have pumped a LOT of oil in my time 60K L ++ over 14 years and I have serious reservations about that motor on that pump.
I converted a bunch of Small Block Chev pumps to move Veg oil I was collecting.  The motors I used were the 24V scooter type motors.  These are relatively slow ( 2600 rpm) but high torque. I coupled the motor and pump with a similar Lovejoy coupler to the one you are using.

The pump you have being a gear pump is going to want slow and high torque, not high speed.  Oil is thick and heavy and just won't move at the pace I believe that motor wants to drive it.  It's also only 30 W and that alone will I believe make the thing strain and burn out in short order.
While you will pay more for one, I would highly recommend a scooter motor around 250W. Even the small ones at 100W would have vastly better torque than the little motor you show.
They will be 24V but work just fine on 12V. I did about 90% of my pumping with the motor on 12V because at half voltage the pump still gave about 75% flow rate as it did at 24V, the pump was far quieter, the motor could pump loads more oil without heating up too much And the way I modified the pumps, full flow/ speed meant hoses could blow themselves around like a garden hose gone wild. Not what you want when it's Veg oil coming out.

Other motors that may be good for this little pump are Car wiper motors which are geared down for low speed and high torque or electric radiator fan or  interior Demister blower motors.
Anything with a bit of size is going to be far better for this application that a little high speed motor.  I have some radiator fan motors I have used for many summers ventilating a window in my house and they run for about 3+ months a year 24/7. They were off 15yo cars when I got them and still going strong. Clearly longevity is not an issue with these things. The scooter Motors also seem to give good service. One on my oil pump must be 6-7 years old and it would have pumped at least 20K Litres of oil .  It's gets double duty. Has to pump into the tank when I am at the restaurant and then back out again when I get home into the IBC. I pick up  up to 400L at a time so it's an 800L exercise when combined


Found a vid of my oil pumps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8o52BYTEau4

Another thing with what you want to do is the filtering.
The pump will be positive displacement which means when the flow is restricted, the torque required to drive it goes through the roof. Basically on my pumps the motor will stall if you restrict or block or the things will head north of 100lbs and a hose will blow ( or crush).  I have another pump I modified on a 3Hp Ac motor I use for moving oil around at home.  I can stall that motor really easy just by turning a valve that restricts/ shuts off  the oil flow.

You are going to be pumping through a filter so that will be a restriction that will be a greater load on the motor the more blocked it becomes.  I'd recommend putting a bypass valve on the setup or at least a re settable circuit breaker that will trip when the amps on the motor get too high.  Another suggestion would be to where possible over size all your connections and fittings. The smallest size you want anywhere is the exit  diameter of the pump itself.  You will probably use a car filter that will never need changing on this engine but a breaker that will reset even if the oil is too cold and the motor load too great would be prudent I think.

And one more thing......
Don't automatically assume the pump and motor have to be perfectly aligned.  I did that, many times, and couldn't figure why the pump was basically binding up as evidenced by the squealing.  Chev pumps are pretty rough in they just run in the casing rather than a bearing ( they are in an sump of oil I suppose) but what I found was happening was the pump when working was loading up on one side and causing drag.
I had to allow some play or offset on the alignment to get the thing to run right while pumping. Curiously, the pump run fine in forward and reverse once the offset was made.
I could tell when it was right by spinning the pump and turning it off. If the thing stopped as soon as the power was cut, it was binding.  If it ran on a bit and would  slow down ( aided by the inertia of the oil in the hoses) in a second or 2, then I knew it was " misaligned" Correctly.

Your pump ( could you put a link where you got it BTW? ) may be more precisely machined and not have this issue but before you spend too much time setting up the alignment and redoing it many times over wondering what the hell you were doing wrong as I did, just be aware of this possibility.  The fact it's not right may not be your workmanship is sloppy, rather it's too damn accurate and that's the real problem.

Anyway, I'd consider alternative motors because I don't think that one is right for the job for which you want it.

[Jesse McB]

Glort, thats excatly why i posted the pictures and information of my oil pump, i had a feeling the motor may be to weak, and you just verifyed that for me! Thankyou! Im going for the 12v / 24v  100 watt scooter motor on ebay they have them for $30, only $10 more! They have a 8mm shaft so i can use the same coupler, i have not purchased the parts yet to build this oil pump. I will post pics of the details for this oil pump.

So yes it will be just used to filter the oil in the engine, so it can prolonged oil and engine life. the engine has just one litre of oil so i dont need the pump to work hard, just a flow rate of a liter or so a minute would be great!

Im thinking of having the drain port as the "oil out" and the refill port as the "oil in" port. This engine has a small size hole in the  bearing wall  to allow oil to transfer between the gear side and crank side. If the flow rate is to fast it will cause uneven oil levels in the engine, Im going to include an electronic oil pressure sensor in the high pressure end  to shut everything down if it losses pressure, ill attatch the when it comes to over pressure, ill just be careful, worst come to worse if it over pressures and pops a line or something it will shutdown from no oil pressure since it all got spit out.  but that will be unlikly as its just for filtering the oil, it wont be doing anything eles, im hoping it wont drag to much power, probably a few amps. I may use a dc dimmer switch to lower the speed incase it works to hard  

The control panel was easy to build! All the parts are on ebay! They all cost about $12 per gauge. Maybe i should construct genny control panels and sell them?    

I agree that i over did it for this engine!!!! But i couldnt help it! It just looks to perfect to be kept in its old original looking state! These are like the most smallest watercooled  automotive style diesel engines in production. And they are VERY RARE in north america   So I decided it can have some made in Canada and some quality control put into it.   installed new usa made SKF bearings for the crank and camshaft.  It had some faulty parts when i recieved it "new old stock" , the cylinder had a scratch from casting sand probly still usable, the valve guides were trash, and it was missing an internal bearing retaining bolt. I put so much time and money for the sake that it will last for a long time!  I know these engine run very well at around half load, they like running around 1800 to 2000 rpm.  I remember i seen a website based in europe somewere, selling these smaller changfas for over $1000 USD! But theres no life span information on these smaller Real changfa diesels anywere on the internet! one thing i notice is parts are very cheap at least!  I will only need about 400 watts of juice for charging batterys,  running my power in my cabin. Maybe build a quick simple gokart to feel its power haha   i wont use the crap out of it as i do have my never used 4hp Kubota diesel engine  for power.    I dont need to worry about it getting dirty as its very easy to keep clean and no oil leaks. I cant beilive it took me a year to build this, and im still not finished !  I still need a muffler! But im not to worried, with the flex exhaust pipe i find its easy to attach to any muffler laying around.



I forgot to mention, the oil pump im getting is the Top-10A Model

[Jesse McB]

Heres a photo of the RPM gauge senor, ill need to install one of them good flat magnets on the flywheel for the sensor.  

[Jesse McB]

5 electric start changfa type diesels for sale! I know someone thats selllng 5 changfa type watecooled diesels, i think they are the 15hp ones 1100, just after the s195. So buddy says they are bearly used, all 5 are electric start hopper cooled,  but been sitting in the barn for many years, selling all 5 for $1000!!! Thats  $200 each! ! I would like to buy 2 asap but he told me he will only sell al 5 at once! Hopefully i save up in time to buy them for next week or we all group together and buy the entire lot! Lol now that will be a long shot! They Are located by niagara falls area canada. Im gonna have the money for them for sure by next 2 weeks so if they available ill be scooping them up, imspect the 3 other omes clean em  and sell em for good deal! They are electric start so thats amazing deal!

[glort]

Sounds like bargain of the century!
I'd give the guy whatever you have now to hold them for you for a couple of weeks.  I'd have sure bought the lot for that price!

I'm going to get ( hopefully) a lister SR2 Tomorrow. Dunno if it's a goer or yard decoration ATM but I hope it's more the former.  Have to get it off a wharf up a set of steep narrow steps and into a trailer. Hope it's worth it!

[Derb]

Those SR2's are heavy little suckers! Damn rowdy also. Good luck.

[Jesse McB]

Im gonna have some fun with the small diesel again soon! Im gonna remake the alternator bracket, beef it up more, and add in a larger cooling fan. The control panel is ready to be assembled,  i been so busy with my work i havent touched the engine in months lol, even though i look at it everyday wih a quick peak woundering if anything could be modified better lol. Im gonna put a few new fastners like new bolts and nuts to shine it up some more. Im really looking to have that "new untapered  marine engine look" without the rigged-up parts look. So yeah the wooden frame may be tempary for awhile till i make something better.

[Jesse McB]

I Need some advice for my diesel please! Im heading to Novascotia in a few days for a few weeks at my offgrid cabin, im taking the little diesel with, not using it for prime power, thats what the kubota is for just gonna have some fun with this engine! Ok so i need some opinions on a running problem for my little engine. I posted an updated vid on youtube, please watch!

So when I start it up it runs very nice, runs and sounds beautifully perfect unloaded while idling and at high-speed,. So initially to say the deepcycle battery is connected and the alternators field current is activated so there is slight load.

But When I apply a load " hairdryer" the engine after its warmed up it will run slighty rouph, slight coughs of black exhaust but not extreme though. When i unload the engine it will run perfect, and this is after an hour of runtime. Its not bad enouph that i don't want to run the engine,  It may not be noticeable in the video i posted., And i have no muffler just a straight flex pipe so the exhaust is kinda loud     i hear it more in the exhaust note. , the rpms stay stable its not like a hunting issue.  I used a 400 watt hairdryer and with inverter and alternator efficiency losses its about a 900 watt load. With my kubota diesel, when i have it powering my ST 3 i remember when if the belt loosens it would run the same way, when id tighten the belt it would run smooth every beat. Im thinking maybe my little diesels flywheel is too slippery, causing the belt to slip and catch, making it run uneven when loaded? I do hear the belt makes a squeak noise with every power stroke when i have a load on. I did paint my flyweel with a high gloss black enamel   hopefuly i just answered my own question!   Because this engine is just to damn cool looking to run this way!

[Jesse McB]

Before my next test run, im thinking I'll repaint the outer flywheel rim but add some fine sand dust or something to embed in the paint. I'm thinking if the belt don't slip, the engine should run very smooth. Has anyone had a similar problem?  If a belt is loose while driving a Gen head, the Diesel engine will hiccup every few revolutions. I can't find anything online about this issue. I work a lot, and live at a town house with neighbors everywhere so I'm limited on time when I can run it.

[glort]

Hi Jesse,

The problem with the way the thing is running in the vid is you are simply running the engine too slow! that's making it Hunt.

Engine power for general term is a product of RPM x torque.  For example, an engine might do 10 Hp at it's rated RPM of 2600 RPM. At 1500RPM it might be doing 5 HP and at 1000 rpm might be doing 2 Hp.
The less revs the less power.
You are loading your little engine with a 1.5 Hp load when the thing is producing probably 1 HP.  The poor thing is just trying to overcome the overload. 800W at low RPM is a huge ask from that size engine and is the source of your problems.

There is a power Curve for an engine which is the power it makes at a given RPM and also a torque sweet spot. You have a pretty big pulley in the engine to start with which also increases the load.  Simply turn the revs up and it will be fine. It's not good to have the engine hunting like that for any period. If puts bad thrust loads on the piston, hammers the bearings and will cause the thing to soot up no matter what fuel you run.
You just need to get the thing up on it's power curve by increasing the RPM and it will be fine.

If you have got the thing reved up and it still is hunting, you need to reduce the pulley size on the engine.

Also be aware that car alts with the standard  control circitury in the voltage regulator are horribly inefficient.  If that is an 80A alt, It could be pulling 3.5 HP without much trouble. 800W is over 1 HP and that is electrical load, not mechanical. I'd say the actual load on the engine is more like double that given the mechanical losses alone.  Then there is the gearing.

It's not hunting too bad though so if you give the thing some revs and let it get into it's power/ torque curve, it should be fine.
Simple a soloution as you will ever find!  :0)

[Jesse McB]

Thank you glort for the info, Anyone know were to have a stub shaft made? Id love to have a real pulley, i notice there is 3 outter bolt holes on the flyweel for a bigger pulley.  When i get to Nova scotia ill be spending time figuring everything about it! I can make all the noise i want aswell lol. I was thinking maybe it could be the size of the flywheel affecting it, putting to much torque on the engine?  I will belt it to my st3 head and put a good load on it with the original pulley. I still have not uploaded the new vid, i forgot too, ill do that as soom as possible!

[Henry W]

I agree with glort. I've learned much where the RPM sweetspot is on engines. I try to run engines about 200 RPM's above peak torque curve. When an engine gets loaded the RPM's drop some and 200 RPM's is about right to keep an engine close to the peak torque curve.

[mobile_bob]

as for a pulley, this is what i have done i the past

if you remove the oem pulley and look closely at the flywheel, where the bolt holes are
you will see the "register" steps, and he back of the oem pulley is machined so that the pulley
seats into this register.

you will need to carefully check the fit of the oem pulley to the register, some are quite loose/sloppy
and because they are a 3 bolt pattern it is not easy to determine the actual size.

my s195 was .070" sloppy, which allowed me to wrap one turn of .035 mig wire around the step i machined into
my new pulley and fit it to the register tightly.... i didn't check the slop/play before i had the pulley machined or i would have
caught the problem and had the pulley machined .070" bigger on the step.

i used a 9" cast iron pulley on the 195, iirc it is a 4 groove A-B section, and i run AA belts which set a bit deeper in the grooves.

i am using AA (hexagonal) belts as i can change them out without having to remove the st7.5 or the engine when they wear out.

i run a matched pair of AA belts to drive twin 110-555jho modified alternators, and a sanden compressor (a/c and refer) and of course not all things run at the same time.

fwiw, i really like close mounting the cast iron pulley right to the flywheel.  it is more compact and doesn't require an adapter/shaft to then fit a pulley onto.

bob g

[Jesse McB]

Hello! So I moved back to Nova Scotia in the boonies at my Camp,  Currently using the Kubota diesel for prime power.  I'm giving real test runs of this small changfa is running well with tons of low end torque, it is burning oil as it's still 12 hrs breaking in. I'm using a DC 12V 1000 watt microwave for a load bank.   So I'm liking running it around 1800~2000 rpm then the rated 2600 rpm for noise reduction and fuel efficiency.  I installed a small muffler and works Great! But the knocking sound is still loud! So I'm thinking adjusting the injection timing may work abit? Or maybe even adjust the injector screw? I'm going to post new updated videos of the engine. The pressure cooling system works great! The alternator system puts out easy 1000 Watts with the engine running around 1800 rpm it's doing just what I want! Just I really think I could knock down the knocking sounds alittle bit 

Reviving my old thread! 

[glort]

I would try backing off the timing a bit first.
I have had a few of the China Vertical Cyl engines that sound like someone it banging on them with a hammer. I shimmed the pumps out and the difference was significant.

If you don't have any Shims, what I did was scan one that was on the engine, copy it 1:1 for a standard sheet size and then print them onto thick single Ply cardboard as a template and cut them out from there.  Add a few at a time till the harsh knocking goes away. There is every possibility the thing is timed too advanced anyway.  I don't know what the standard for fuel is in china but it's different to what it is here or they just use " The force" to time them in the first place.

Certainly a very impressive little engine you put together there.
Is my memory right in thinking you had bought a bigger engine and were going to do that up as well?