Fuel rail shut down

[coppersmith]

Are there any know long term problems with fuel rail only, shut down on lister 6/1. Try to rig remote shut down.

[BruceM]

Most of the solenoid fuel shutoff valves will NOT work for a 6/1 shut down, but the Murphy solenoid valve will.  The problem is that the suction of the IP is strong enough to make most leak.   This from experience (the failure of a quality valve) and the notice here by someone with success using the Murphy valve.

Best Wishes,
Bruce

[coppersmith]

Thank Bruce , Will rephrase , was try to keep it short. Have always used 2 step shut down. Was wondering if not using decompression lever would cause long term issue. Thanx  again bill

[AdeV]

Thank Bruce , Will rephrase , was try to keep it short. Have always used 2 step shut down. Was wondering if not using decompression lever would cause long term issue. Thanx  again bill

Shutting a lister down on the decompression lever is not recommended - you'll get excessive cam and/or tappet wear... you're supposed to just pull the fuel rack shut & wait. I can't remember if Lister SoMs did both fuel rack & decompressor...

[mike90045]

Shutting a lister down on the decompression lever is not recommended - you'll get excessive cam and/or tappet wear... you're supposed to just pull the fuel rack shut & wait. I can't remember if Lister SoMs did both fuel rack & decompressor...

What about decompressing a listeroid, after fuel rack is shut, and it's down to 20 rpm, so it does not bounce CC & CCW when it can't roll past the compression ?

[BruceM]

I use both decompression and a fuel rack closer, and so does the Lister CS SOM.  Mine is operated from a single air solenoid and two air cylinder actuators, the SOM had a single large electric solenoid that did both.  This is handy for starting as well, since they need to be operated together for that operation.

Not using decompression on shut down would be fine, but I do like the security of decompression for failsafe shut down in case the rack jams or some other failure allows a run away.  My Picaxe controller does a failsafe shut down for oil high or low, rpm out of range, excess vibration, or excess temperature. 

Some folks use some very impressive CO2/Halon or air shutoff valves as backup for rack closing.  I needed remote start capability and my rubber drive wheel Gast 4AM air motor starter can't crank through compression until at speed.  So I had to build a little air soleniod valve lifter anyway, and decided to use it just as the SOM did.

[coppersmith]

Bruce, do you have any pic or specs on your set up? I would like to do the double set up like you have. Blew my hip out , the walk to gen sheds getting longer & longer!! Thanx for the help ! Trying the put the string method for now. 

[AdeV]

Shutting a lister down on the decompression lever is not recommended - you'll get excessive cam and/or tappet wear... you're supposed to just pull the fuel rack shut & wait. I can't remember if Lister SoMs did both fuel rack & decompressor...

What about decompressing a listeroid, after fuel rack is shut, and it's down to 20 rpm, so it does not bounce CC & CCW when it can't roll past the compression ?

I suspect the additional wear would be minimal...

As Bruce says - the SoM shut down using simultaneous rack & decompressor activation (I should have known that, as I have one, and there is a mechanical linkage between decompressor and fuel rack).

On standard engines, IIRC the procedure is to move the fuel lever to the shut-off position, and when the engine is almost stopped, engage the decompression lever.

[BruceM]

Here's my decompressor photos.
My decompressor  actually lifts the exhaust tappet, instead of just providing a stop to prevent valve closing.  This is easy with an air actuator since they have so much force.

An alternate method would be to use a solenoid or RC servo to move the stock valve lifter into position.  With that method, you'd have to ALWAYS decompress on shut down, so that the lifter would be in place for starting.  The SOM uses a BIG solenoid to do both the rack closer and place an insert to hold the valve open (which does not really lift the valve).  

Subsequent to these pictures, I drilled and tapped the cam oiling bolt, since it's used as the lifter hold down.  I installed a hollow brass tube "reed in the wind" to assist oiling, and a #8 screw now caps the oiling bolt so a shot of oil can be added regularly.

I left the standard valve lifter assembly in place, as my design goal was to allow standard manual operation in case of a failure of the electronics or actuators.

Best Wishes,
Bruce

[veggie]

coppersmith,

Using only the decompression to kill the engine would still leave the fuel system activated and allow another 50 to 75 injections of fuel into the cylinder before coasting to a stop. This unused fuel can run past the rings and dilute your oil over time.
If you only use this shutdown method once in a while, it may not cause any problems but if done on a daily basis you may need to keep an eye on your oil.
I don't think the CS engines don't really create enough crankcase heat to vaporize diesel fuel they way modern engines do.

cheers,
veggie

[coppersmith]

THANX ALL FOR REPLYS, SEAMS TO HAVE GOTTEN OFF TRACK. LOOKING FOR LONG TERM ISSUES WITH FUEL RAIL ONLY SHUT DOWN, NOT DECOMPRESSION SHUT DOWN.MOST MANUALS STATE TO USE THEM TOGETHER . I THINK BRUCE GOT IT.

[oiler]

Lister recommended to use the closing of fuel rack ONLY!!