New user questions need help for OTG Cabin CHP

[ncgyver]

I am looking for viable options for a Fulltime CHP for my OTG cabin in So Colorado. I would like to get a lister but they have been elusive for me. I've looked at a CNG engine cause there are alot of wells going in this part of the world. Even talked to a local pump mechanic and he mentioned a water cooled motorcycle, scooter or atv engine converted to run a gen. I've read tons of posts on this site but only opens more doors. Recommendations ?? SOmething viable, available, efficient ?? Thx all

[WStayton]

Hi and Welcome to the forum!

  A little more information would help folks make intelligant recomendations - If I recommend a 6 cylinder turbo Cummins that is going to be serious overkill if you think that you need a 5 kW generator!

  It sorta SOUNDS like you want Something in the 10 kW range or less if you were looking at a Lister, but Listeroid's, at least, have largely become unavailable due to the EPA protecting us from ourselves!

  Also, it would be nice to know if you are looking for an air cooled unit, ar a liquid cooled unit.  Again, from the sounds of your post, talking about CHP, I would think that you are looking for a liquid cooled unit, but it would be better if you specified,

  Another issue is do you intend to use any alternative fuels, like SVO, or WVO or even natural gas as part fuel in a diesel.  For WVO/SVO, some engines seem to have much better performance in terms of their longevity.

  mobilebob has experience with the  changfa 195 idi, so he can probably fill you in there, though I THINK he is busy moving at the moment.  Changfa made/makes quie a few engines, so something from them might match your requirements.

  Kubota also makes a veriety of small diesels in various sizes from a couple of HP single, up to something like a 40 HP four banger.  And, these can be found about it new and used specimens, though new anythin from Kubota I think is pretty pricey!

  If you are interested in getting something that "needs work" that opens up a whole panalopy of options for you!  Also, it usually means that you emerge, albeit a bit scarred, with a much better understanding of YOUR engine.

  Just walking up and saying "What engine do you recommend?" is a lot like saying "What vehicle should I get?".  It is strictly dependent on what YOU want to do with it!  You would have a hard time hauling hogs to market in one of the new small hybrids and you would look strange driving, solo, in a 4-door, ful size diesel pickup to go to Church!

  Again, welcome aboard!

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

[BioHazard]

Are you sure you're up to the investment for CNG tanks and compressors as opposed to other fuels? Those things are *VERY* expensive....

[luv2weld]

If you are serious about the Listeroid, there are engines out there.

http://diesel-electric.us/cs_clones.htm

I hear there are kits out there that you can put together. Listeroid air compressors that you can convert to
an engine.

There have to be engines available or Sean wouldn't be posting this.....http://www.microcogen.info/index.php?topic=2037.0

Where in Colorado, and what elevation? Elevation makes a difference in how much horse power you can get out.
You may have a 5hp engine but if you're pretty high up, you might only be able to get 2 or 3 hp out of it.

Someone else should jump in here and tell him about GM90's.
What about finding a wrecked motorhome or RV and salvaging the generator out of it??
Build your own from a small gas engine (just like the pump mechanic said) and a generator head?? Or lawn mower engine??
Convert the gas engine to CNG or propane??
http://www.propane-generators.com/
There are lots of options. You just have to decide what you want.

Ralph

[ncgyver]

Thx for the reply.
Ideally I'd like to have a lister with one of George's PMG's. I think I can do with 3kw s. I looked at the imports and the air compressor conversion.  I'm going to run small solar for lighting and charging, and the gen for peak loads and battery charging.
Most appliances are LP, But I will need to power 1-TV 27" flat screen, 3-laptops / Charging, Small apps, small fridge (3 way), Satellite box,  intermittent power tools, ignition for ON demand HW.
I'm not looking to run 24/7. I favor a diesel and would like to run alt fuels. Water cooled, and not obtrusively loud. My elevation is about 6200' . Budget is a concern $2000 +/-.
Looked at military MEP200 , looked at RV gens, Generac portables, ANybody running something similar, what's working? We were OTG before in an RV but now we have expanded to a cabin on 1.5 acres.
I would like to build an expanding battery bank / Inv setup. with backup (maybe a small portable) I had a Honda and it worked well as a backup.
I think that covers it.
Someday I would like o get into gasifiers but once I get somewhat settled in.
Thx !

[BioHazard]

These water cooled Kawasakis are supposed to be great engines and probably will last forever at a 3kw power level. They would run great on propane or natural gas...both of which are cheaper than diesel. I would guess you could run it at 1800 RPM if all you wanted was 3kw.

http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=28-1714&catname=engines

[Horsepoor]

I noticed your on demand hot water heater design specification. The smallest one I could find when I built my tool shed was 50 A @ 220 V. Most of the systems I looked at were around 100 A. Even the 50 A version power level is far beyond the capabilties of all but the biggest generator systems. This assumes your on demand hot water heater is electric and not LP.

[luv2weld]

If you want a Listeroid, call Gary. (303-720-3936) He's in Chase, Kansas.
If I read his site correctly, he has six 8/1's in stock.
If you want a true Lister, somewhere on this site, a container is being put together to be shipped
to the US. Somebody here should be able to supply the details.

We used a 4k Onan Emerald out of an RV for years. We are completely off grid, at 9600 feet, central Colorado.
Between Salida and Buena Vista. We converted it to run gasoline and propane. It ran at 1800 rm, so was quiet and
did not consume a lot of fuel. Then we bought one of Gary's listeroids and hooked an ST head to it. It runs a lot slower
and is pretty quiet. We are not even using a muffler. Just run the exhaust into a 10 foot section of 3 inch exhaust pipe.
If we used a muffler, it would probably be so quiet we couldn't hear it. But like a lot of others on this site,
we can tell right away if the rhythm in the background changes. So we know something needs looking at.

I looked at your list of power requirements, but I didn't see anything about water pumping. Do you have a well??
Or are you going to have one in the future??

If water pumping is not a concern, then you may be able to get by for a while by building your own 12 or 24 volt
charger using an old lawnmower engine and a vehicle alternator. If you are a subscriber to HomePower magazine,
there is an explanation in issue 42, Aug/Sep 1994. If you're not a subscriber, I will email you the article. It is a pdf.

You should also look at wind power. It has the capability to work day and night while solar only works in the day time.

http://www.fieldlines.com

http://www.otherpower.com

http://www.scoraigwind.com

Like solar, the wind generator is almost silent. Unless you get something like this

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200320201_200320201

This is NOT something that I would recommend.

What I recommend and have done is here.....

http://www.otherpower.com/turbineplans.shtml

Ralph

[ncgyver]

I noticed your on demand hot water heater design specification. The smallest one I could find when I built my tool shed was 50 A @ 220 V. Most of the systems I looked at were around 100 A. Even the 50 A version power level is far beyond the capabilties of all but the biggest generator systems. This assumes your on demand hot water heater is electric and not LP.

LP for sure,  I  actually have one on the RV that fires on  4 D Batts.

[ncgyver]

I would be interested on getting in on a LIster or clone shipment !!!
We haul our wter to our cistern which is buried 20 ft above the cabin on the hill. We have a 250' well but it's sulphury so we will not pump it to the cabin, I'm thinking about getting a windmill to pump to a shallow holding tank or pond and irrigating from there.