Small Diesels

[WStayton]

Hi Guys:

  I need about a 4 to 5 horse engine for a sickle bar mower I have acquired and about an 8 to 10 horse engine for a chipper/shredder that I have also acquired.

  The walk=behind sickle bar mower is completely ex-engine, it just has the motor mount sitting there with four studs sticking out of it.

  The chipper/shredded has a motor on board, but it was left sitting in a garden shed for about 5 years and is set up TIGHT, so I THINK that it is a goner.

  So, are their small diesels around that will work on either of these applications?  If so, where might one acquire such a beast WITHOUT getting financially raped?  Remember, I'm cheap! <grin>

  I have my doubts that I will find one that works for the sickle bar mower, because it has two drive wheels that are about 24" diameter that are just in front of the engine and only about 8" apart.  The engine weight basically has to be less than the rest of the machine, so it ALMOST balances on the wheels with the rest being borne by shoes under the cutter bar.  A grossly heavier engine would cause the machine to "sit-back-on-its-haunches" and raise the cutter bar off its shoes and up in the air.  I suppose a SLIGHT imbalance could be ballasted out with a lead weight clamped/stuck in to the frame somewhere forward, but a huge ballast wouldn't work because the two tires are only sort of bicycle tires, so there weight carrying capability is pretty limited.  The machine was reported to have previously had a 3.5 Clinton gas engine which was judged to be marginal in power.

  The chipper/shredder could, I think, use any engine that had a horizontal drive shaft.  Since the thing basically just sits while you are using it and then, to move it, you hook on with a lawn tractor and tow it away.

  So, is there any hope of finding a diesel for either of these applications, or should I just shut up and put a gas engine on them???  <grin>

Your comments are hereby solicited and appreciated!

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

[Henry W]

Here is a 6 hp. engine.

http://cgi.ebay.com/6-HP-Air-Cooled-Launtop-LA178-Diesel-Engine-/220793514900?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item336851ab94

[Ronmar]

www.Surpluscenter.com, under Diesel engines.  They have a slew of 4-10HP air-cooled diesels right now from $600-$995...

[WStayton]

hwew;

   Let me start  by saying that what I know about small diesels you could stick under your thumbnail and have lots of room left over!  If it doesn't have at least four cylinders and wasn't used in some sort of road vehicle I'm not sure that I would recognize it as a diesel if I fell  over it!

  It sort of surprise me that the diesel 6.0 only weighed 66 pounds, as opposed to 42 pounds for a Briggs & Stratton gas engine - which, I should THINK, should be slightly more than the 3.5 Clinton that was supposed to have came off of the sickle bar mower!  A pleasant surprise, but a suprise, none the less!

   With the extra twenty or twenty five pounds a little aft of the axle I am thinking that I could fix that with about ten pounds of ballast far forward on the machine.  I'll have to go pile a few cement blocks on the engine mounting pad, and let you know!

  So do you think that the  Launtop LA178 is a pretty good engine?  I guess you must, otherwise you wouldn't have recommended it!  <grin>  But, for the record, what makes you think that it is a good engine?  I see that it is DI, but I guess most everything is DI nowdays - looks like the only way you can get an II is to buy a thirty or forty year old engine, and I don't think they really made many small ones then, at least not that found their way here!  <smile>

  I see that the engine has the capability of battery start, so if I used that engine, I could use the battery as the ballast!  That would really kill two birds with one stone.  I am eager to find out how the tires look with cement blocks piled on to simulate the engine and a battery!  <grin>


Ronmar:

  The Surplus Center's 10 HP looks like it would work well for the chipper/shredder.  It is much heavier than the gasoline engine; 140 labs for the diesel and 60 for their 10 hp Tecumseh gas engine but, for a chipper/shredder, I don't think it matters, in fact, heavier might be better, holding the thing down while your using it so it doesen't play Listeroid and dance all over the place! <grin>

  I will repeat the same question that I put to hwew, what makes you think that this is a good engine - since I wouldn't know a good one from a bad one if I fell over it?!?!?!  <grin>

   The prices are a little alarming, basically being about three times as much for a diesel as for a gas engine - is that pretty "normal" price for a small diesel?  I will have to wrestle with if I want to spend three times as much to have diesel power.

  Oh, one thing I have noticed for generator, is that they usually recommend something of about 10% to 15% less HP for a diesel than a gas engine - I presume this is because the diesel has better low end torque - is that also true for a chipper/shredder, do you think? I mean would 10% to 15% less diesel HP be as effective as the full HP gas engine?

Anyhow, thanx for pointing me in the right direction guys!  I've been looking on CraigsList hoping to find a used small diesel, and in six months, I've seen exactly ONE!!!  So that plan of attack definately wasn't working! <grin>

  As always, thanx for the input!

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

[rcavictim]

Wayne,

I think those engine prices at Surplus Center are a bit over the top.  Definitely NOT priced as surplus!  This high price likely reflects the reduced purchasing power of the US dollar.  In Canada, Princess Auto has that 10 HP engine with electric start for $495.00 CDN.  That is a full $300 cheaper!  They used to carry a 6 HP and a 10 HP in Launtop.  When they had Launtop the 6 HP was $599.00 CDN.  I have managed to buy three of these 6 HP Launtop brand new in the past few years as inventory reduction for large discount.  The 10 HP diesel now being sold looks the same but I think is from a different Chinese manufacturer.  A 10 HP diesel with e-start + 12 volt charging system as well as pull start for $500 sounds like a good deal to me!  Normally we Canadians get ripped every time we want to buy something and it is almost always way cheaper in the USA.  This seems to be a very scarce exception.  I'll take it! 

[BioHazard]

I was going to say the same thing, Surplus Center isn't very good on their engines though every now and then they throw us a bone. Then again us Americans have to take what the EPA will let us have.  I think that Launtop on ebay is about the best deal you're going to find on a new engine.

[rcavictim]

I was going to say the same thing, Surplus Center isn't very good on their engines though every now and then they throw us a bone. Then again us Americans have to take what the EPA will let us have.   I think that Launtop on ebay is about the best deal you're going to find on a new engine.

Bio,

That ebay engine is the exact same model Launtops I got from Princess!  Same color too.  They look top notch.  I haven't fired any up yet.  The wind turbine is taking all of my available time.  I have a small genset project started that will get the first of my inventory.  One will be kept as a spare and the third may end up in a hybrid diesel electric motorcycle or garden tiller.  Nice thing about these is the relative light weight, no radiator to mess with installing and the fact that they are really gonna just sip fuel.

[WStayton]

Hi, Guys!

  Ok, the problem of what to get for the smaller engine is satisfied, now I just have to ballast the unit and see if it will work!  I can't think of any reason why it wouldn't, since the weight of the whole assembly will only be something 100 lbs to 110 lbs, even with the battery as ballast - but I do want to try it with cement blocks and make sure.

  It was fortuitous that that particular engine was the same one the rcavictim has bought, used and loved - I have a lot more faith in something when somebody on here has used it and blessed it as good to go!  Oh, and it was $50 less than rcavictims unit advetised price, though I sure that bargain-hunter-rcavictim didn't pay full boat retail!  <smile>

  My sickle bar mower has what look like bicycle wheels, with wire spokes and the whole deal, except that they are only about 20" in diameter.  I have no idea where I am going to get new ones when/if I need them!  <grin>

  Oh, and I was gratified to see that the $549 price on fleabay included shipping!  Got to be at least $50 or $75 to ship one of those!

  So, for the bigger engine, it seems that the Surplus Center's prices are excessive - where should I look for a more reasonable priced 10 to 12 HP engine?

  If you just put "diesel-engine-for-sale" into Google, you get about 30,000 sites that want to sell you a locomotive engine or a truck engine and if you add "small" it doesn't thin out much - so should I just start opening windows until something pops up?  And, I suspect that if I drive up to Princess auto and buy one of their 10 HP units and then try to convince the customs officer in Niagara Falls, on the way back, that it is an aircompressor or something, I MIGHT have problems!  Had a few go rounds with customs for alleged smuggling when I was flying and I'd prefer not to go through that again!!!

  And, if I find a 10 or 12 HP diesel for a good price, how will I know if the QUALITY of the engine is any good?

  Okay, that my five (more or less! <grin>) questions for today!

Please spill your knowledge of where to look and how to know a good engine when you see one!

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

[rcavictim]

Wayne,

First off, I HAVE NOT run any of the 6 HP Launtops yet, BUT I DO have a great deal of confidence in this brand and particular engine product from anecdotal evidence.  I also know that Princess Auto really does their homework when they offer a product because their warranty is so generous.  If it breaks or you aren't satisfied then they will take it back no questions asked.  I think that is good for a year on their engines.  For that reason I'd be very comfortable purchasing their new offering in the 10 HP air cooled for $499.00.  I don't think you would have any trouble at the border importing it in your trunk.  The problem with EPA regs is when having a common carrier and broker handling it.  Then the strict rules are applied.  Perhaps others here with actual experience importing an engine in their vehicle to the US could chime in here.  I know out friend in Alberta sold a number of Listeroids to US buyers who drove across the border to fetch them in person to beat the EPA restrictions.  They didn't have to lie about what they had either when crossing to the US.  You wouldn't want to do that for sure.  They likely now have lots of space at Guantonamo Bay for anyone who might conspire to terrorize their neighbors with the sound of a non EPA approved small engine.    Homeland Security is totally out of common sense control.

If you need more than 10 HP but less than 20, I think you are into the Chinese horizontal water cooled engines like the Changfa 195 with a built in radiator or use as designed as so many Orientals do on their tractors or whatever with straight hopper cooling.  At 20 HP you get the option of a two cylinder version of ther Launtop 10 HP air cooled single but these seem to go for about $2200-2500.00.  Not cheap.

Here is a video of one of these type of 6 HP engines being demonstrated.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pm4WfH6v004

[rcavictim]

Here is a video demo of a 20 HP twin air cooled like I spoke of.  Translation warning, the sound of the engine is in German. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZIIwd3aLmg

[WStayton]

rcavictim:

  " . . . the sound of the engine is in German . . ."

  Ok, and what language is the "tongue-in-cheek" in???  <grin>

About driving across the border with an engine:

  I have heard/read, and I forgotten where, that the actaul border crossing officers could really care less if you have  and engine in your vehicle, so long as you declare it and pay any duty assessable.  They sort of, for the most part, think that the EPA is full of horse spit, too.  And, they contend, they aren't paid enough to become the enforcer of environmental regulations.

  Having said all that, if they object to your non-certified engine, I suppose you could turn around and return it to Princess and get a refund - or wait until later and hope that another border agent is more lenient.

  It seems like, so far, nobody has heard of them turning back a single owner transported engine.  Has anybody heard anything different???


  Oh, rcavictim, sorry about the confusion on whether or not you had actually used any of your engines - I did remember you saying somewhere that you had yet to do the deed, but that was after I had pushed "post" button and the "take back" button on my computer doesn't seem to be working!  <grin>

  I may be a little scarce on here for the next few days, since I've got to chase off and "rescue" three or possibly four pickup loads of used aluminum siding I have purchased for my house.  I am paying the princely sum of $500 for about 30 squares of siding along with all the channels, and pieces/parts and flat stock for eaves, etc., etc.  I figure that since I only need about 20 square to do the job, I SHOULD be safe in assuming that I can get that amount of useable siding out of 30 square - unless it has been removed by a gorilla using a roof scraper!!!  In which case, I will be turning around and returning home without the siding and with the $500!  <grin>  The only hitch is that is about 180 miles away!  I may win the mileage award next week!

  Thanx for the input - its appreciated!

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton


Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

[cognos]

Here's some...

http://www.carrollstream.com/category_s/39.htm

[Henry W]

Hi Wayne,

The person that posted the Ebay ad I listed  is a microcogen member. I spoke to him numerous times and he sold lot of these Launtop engines and had no problems with the ones he sold. I seen some up close and they are high quality engines. I am planning to pick up a 10 hp soon and put it away.

It is free shipping in the 48 states.

Give Chuck a call: (770) 861-8434

Henry

[WStayton]

Hi Guys!

  Guess what, the same seller that has the 6 HP Launtop engine on fleabay also has the 10 HP one!  And, its only $30 more than the 6 HP!!!  How's that for a deal - 4 HP for $30!!!  Oh, and that one includes shipping, too!!

  http://cgi.ebay.com/10-HP-Air-Cooled-Launtop-Diesel-Engine-/220805571441?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item336909a371

  One question:  Does anybody know what the seller's ID is on this forum?  Being cheap, I thought I would contact him, ex-fleabay, and see if there is any discount available for avoiding the whole fleabay panalopy of crap.  Yea, I know, his phone number was published here, but remember I AM cheap and email is free!!!

  Okay, I'm off to the wilds of Steuber County to get a place ready for my pile of siding, whose transportation/arrival starts tomorrow!

  Thanx, everybody, for holding  my hand!  When you know nothing about something it IS good to have somebody who has "been-there/done-that" to look over your shoulder and keep you from making stupid mistakes!

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

 

[Henry W]

Chucks user name is Newdyne.

He has not written anything on the forum yet so the best thing to do is give him a call.

Henry