a note from George B. of utterpower

[mobile_bob]

guys, you might want to check this out

http://www.utterpower.com/combined_heat_and_power.htm

the lower half i asked if i could post it here, and got permission, then figured what the heck
i would just link over to it.

looks like there are some possibilities working within the rules of the epa?

check it out, comments are welcome

bob g

[Shipo]

really Interesting....thanks bob...any plan to bring some of those nice air compressor ..

[mobile_bob]

seems to me that there ought to be some interest in these aircompressors

for all sort of uses, both intended and unintended.

i guess it all comes down to price and needs of the buyer, if he is handy and can
fit it properly to get it to do what he needs done.

having the ability to get a water cooled compressor that looks like an engine and shares the same parts
would dramatically reduce the parts inventory one would need to have on hand to have both if that is what
he wanted.

i expect we will be seeing them available sooner than later.

bob g

[Crofter]

I wonder how long before some other manufacturers start to maker compressor renditions of their engines. Depending on whether or not they leave the camshaft in (to drive the oil pump of course ) it might not take much to have it born again.

[rcavictim]

I wonder how long before some other manufacturers start to maker compressor renditions of their engines.

EDIT:  I removed my rendition, and torturing an engine joke since no-one seemed to share my sense of dark humor.

The idea of providing a diesel engine like the kind we DIY'ers here like with a compressor programmed camshaft is a terrific idea IMO to get compliance with new restrictive import rules.  That hole in the head where the injector once lived seems like it ought to be a great place for an inspection plug.

[elnav]

Would these  compressors also lend thmselves to being converted to run on methane?  Being  a gas fuel, no complex carburetor  or diesel injector pump  would be needed,  A gas mixer box could easily be added to intake and a Wisconsin type magneto added  to the crankshaft.  Seeing as how natural gas is already touted as a clean burning fuel for prototype vehicles I don't think the EPA would raise  big objections. 

[mobile_bob]

i think they could be made to run on anything that is flammable and available, with a little work.

bob g

[Apogee]

I also posted this in the EPA discussion under Politics, but this thread is where I meant to post it and simply put it in the wrong place.

I emailed Lovson about their new compressors and below is the communication chain including pricing.

Regards,

Steve

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Dear Steve,

Thank you for your e-mail of 1st May,2010 and the interest shown in our Company and product.

Please note,DHL will be very expensive,we will send by sea.

We give below Shipping charges  up to SEATTLE port as under:

COST OF AIR COMPRESSOR
US$820.00 PER UNIT FOB INDIAN PORT
US$220.00  CRATE PACKING
US$200.00  SHIPPING CHARGES UP TO SEATTLE PORT
----------------
US$1240.00  C&F PER UNIT SEATTLE PORT
=========

COST OF kit to rebuild it as engine
US$ 140.00 PER UNIT FOB INDIAN PORT
US$   50.00  CRATE PACKING
US$ 150.00  SHIPPING CHARGES UP TO SEATTLE PORT .
----------------
US$340.00 C&F PER UNIT SEATTLE PORT
=========

IF YOU NEED THE BREAKUP OF KIT WE WILL SEND TO YOU.

WE WILL ALSO BE SENDING YOU THE CD SHOWING HOW TO ASSEMBLE THE AIR COMPRESSOR.

DISPATCH : 3 WEEKS AFTER CONFIRMATION OF ORDER AND RECEIPT OF PAYMENT.

SHIPMENT : 3 weeks


PLEASE NOTE,ALL THE PORT,CUSTOMS AND TRANSPORT CHARGES FROM PORT TO YOUR WAREHOUSE / DOOR WILL BE TO YOUR ACCOUNT.

To facilitate your import we will provide you a "GSP" certificiate under the Generalised System of Preferences which allows you to import goods from INDIA at very nominal customs duty.  This system is for goods from developing countries and all goods from such countries attract reduced customs duty.  Inform this to your customs authority when asking for duty rates.

Request you to study our website: www.slowspeedengine.com - LITTLE GIANT which is our new model / invention this engine has counter weighed cranks.Our technical data is on website with picture.

Our payment terms are as under:

PAYMENT : BY WIRE TRANSFER WITH ORDER

VALIDITY : OFFER VALID UP TO 10.05.2010

IF YOU NEED FURTHER DETAILS DO LET US KNOW WE WILL REPLY TO YOU.

Best Regards
Joanna Bhat

LOVSON
98, Bajaj Bhavan,
Nariman Point,
Mumbai 400 021,
INDIA .

Tel: + 91-22 - 42129898 (Ext.123)
          91 22 - 42129809 (Direct)
Fax:+ 91-22 - 42129844
Websites: www.lovson.com
                 www.lovson.co.in
                 www.auto-rickshaw.com
                 www.motosindia.com
                 www.slowspeedengine.com
-----Disclaimer---------
The contents of this E-mail (including the contents of the enclosure/(s) or
attachment/(s) if any) are privileged and confidential material of Lovson
Exports Limited and should not be disclosed to, used by or copied in any
manner by anyone other than the intended addressee/(s). If this E-mail
(including the enclosure/(s) or attachment/(s) if any) has been received in
error, please advise the sender immediately and delete it from your system.
The views expressed in this E-mail message (including the enclosure/(s) or
attachment/(s) if any) are those of the individual sender.


> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "SlowSpeedEngine.com" <postmaster@slowspeedengine.com>
> To: <wse@lovson.com>
> Sent: 01 May, 2010 20:02
> Subject: Business Enquiry Through SlowSpeedEngine.com
>
>
>
> Greetings,
>
> I am interested in an LG Air Compressor.
>
> How much do they cost?
>
> Also, I understand you offer a Select Parts Kit to convert it to a diesel
> engine.  How much does that kit cost?
>
> Finally, how much would be the total for the unit, shipped using DHL to
> Seattle, WA?  I can pick it up at the DHL facility here in Seattle.
>
> Please let me know.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Steve

[mobile_bob]

in my humble opinion

it just doesn't make sense to order a single or even a couple engine or compressors from india or china
the total cost is insanely expensive.

economies of scale would dictate that the per unit true cost would be far less if they were bought in bulk, by
someone that has the connections to get it done right, even allowing for a reasonable profit to the importer.

the cost outlined in the email from lovson is bad enough, but factor in all the homeland security, brokerage, doc fee's
customs fee's and any other bozo that thinks he can put a stamp on it and charge extra and i would not be surprised if
a single unit would cost near 2 grand.

it doesn't cost much more to ship a container load than it does for a single unit, so the cost of shipping divided by perhaps
50 units works out to be pocket change per unit.

i figure i am better off having a relationship with an importer here, that might offer some warrantee, repair parts and other support
rather than me trying to save a hundred bucks and do it all myself and be left with having to learn how to speak some indian dialect
and be left with what?  and would i really save anything?  is my time worth nothing?

maybe George imports air compressors and we pay him a reasonable profit and save all the grief of going it alone, and probably save
money in the end.

thats the way i see it.

bob g

[Dail R H]

OT, I know , but did anybody check out the autorickshaws? I want one

[rcavictim]

OT, I know , but did anybody check out the autorickshaws? I want one

I looked at those too. Over here you could register it as a motorcycle but if you drove one in Toronto, every time you came for a stop for a traffic light Indians and Pakistanis would pile into it thinking you were a taxi service, just like at home.

[Apogee]

Agreed Bob.

Definitely would be far cheaper to import a full container if someone had deep enough pockets to do so.

I posted the info because I figured once the supply of readily available clones dries up, if someone really wanted one they'd have an idea of what it would cost to get one.

I do think this avenue is the correct way to legally import one into the US.  At least the option still exists for someone to be able to buy a new Listeroid if they want to.

Smart move on Lovson's part imho!

Steve

[k_jab]

For historical interest, - here's a few quotes from Lovson from 2005, before they really got into the US market.

How times and prices have changed.   Raw material and energy costs have certainly risen since 2005. Labour costs are also higher.  

The first is a standard 6/1.  Nearest port would be Duluth - but thats a long sail from the Atlantic!

The last two quotes are for the fairly non-standard 10/1.  The problem with the larger singles is that they are such a deviation away from the original Lister specification, some parts non-standard, and a little dangerous swinging a 24" flywheel at 1000 rpm to get 10hp.  There were even some 12/1 and 16/1 engines being offered - best to stay well clear of these deviant 'oids.

The first quote is in British Pounds.  In 2005 there was between 1.88 and 1.91 US$ to the pound.


Ken

Thank you for your E-mail of 29th October,2005 and the interest shown in our Company and product.

We are glad to offer:

VERTICAL TYPE LISTER  WATER COOLED (Tapper Roller Bearing)  DIESEL OIL
ENGINES.


SR.   MODEL     H.P. / cyl   RPM     BORE & STROKE     US$ PER NO.
NO                                     MM                                 (COST OF 1 ENGINE)
                                                                                    FOB INDIAN PORT

1      SL-6          6/1CYL       650        114.3 X 139.7           432.00

OPTIONAL ACCESSORIES:

RADIATOR                  $ 180.00
ELECTRIC START       $  280.00

The shipping Cost upto Northfield, Minnesota port is as under:

LISTER TYPE 6/1
US$432.00 -FOB MUMBAI (COST OF 1 ENGINE)
US$150.00 -HANDLING & SHIPPING CHARGES UPTO Northfield Minnesota
US$  40.00 - FUMIGATION CHARGES(AS PER NEW LAW,ALL WOODEN CASES TO BE
                   TREATED)
------------
US$622.00 C&F Northfield,Minnesota port
========

This has reference to your E-mail of 23rd August,2005.


We are glad to offer:


SR.   MODEL    H.P. / cyl    RPM     BORE & STROKE     GBP PER NO.
NO                                     MM FOB INDIAN PORT


1       SLC-10      10             1000            120 X 139.7 360.00

THE SHIPPING COST TO FELEXSTOWE WILL BE AS UNDER::

GBP 360.00  -  FOB MUMBAI
GBP   70.00  -   HANDLING & SHIPPING CHARGES UPTO FELEXSTOWE
--------------
GBP 430.00  C&F FELEXSTOWE
=========


ALL OTHER TERMS REMAIN UNCHANGE.



Best Regards
Joanna Bhat

LOVSON EXPORTS LTD.,
98, Bajaj Bhavan,
Nariman Point,
Mumbai 400 021
INDIA

Tel: 91-22-22024071 / 22021918
Fax: 91-22-56360830 / 22045488

E-mail  : joanna@lovson.com
          www.lovson.com

> This has reference to your E-mail of 27th October,2005.
>
> We are glad to offer:
>
> *VERTICAL TYPE LISTER  WATER COOLED (Tapper Roller Bearing)  DIESEL OIL
> ENGINES.
> *
>
> SR.   MODEL     H.P. / cyl     RPM     BORE & STROKE       US$ PER NO.
> NO
> MM                                  (COST OF 1 ENGINE)
>
> FOB INDIAN PORT
>
> 1      SLC-10       10/1CYL       1000       120 X 139.7
> 495.00
>
> *OPTIONAL ACCESSORIES:
> *
> RADIATOR                   $ 180.00
> ELECTRIC START       $  280.00
>
> THE TOTAL COST UPTO DUBLIN (IRELAND) VIA FELIXSTOWE
>
>  LISTER TYPE SLC-10
>  US$ 495.00  -  FOB MUMBAI (COST OF 1 ENGINE)
>  US$  100.00  -   HANDLING & SHIPPING CHARGES UPTO DUBLIN
>   US$.  40.00  -  FUMIGATION CHARGE (AS PER NEW LAW)
> ------------------
>  US$.635.00  - C&F DUBLIN
>  ========

[JohnF]

I fairly regularly import Indian engines into Canada and price have gone up considerably over the past few years.  My supplier (JKSoN) tells me it is because the Indian government is selling all the scrap steel (from those beached ships) to China, so the Indian guys have to compete.  Shipping costs haven't gone up that much, but my latest shipment was held up in Montreal for customs inspection - the inspection was free, but the robber transport people charged $1,000 to move the container to the customs station and return it to the dock - probably about 10 miles in total.  Of course, if you don't pay, you don't get your goods......joys and pleasures of importing.  In the end it will likely have cost me the same amount (or more) to get the container from Montreal to Bourget, ON (about 100 miles) as it did to get it from Mumbai to Montreal.  For those interested in the U.S., pm me and we can talk about options in getting you an engine.