Generator sales?

[davidssfx]

Hi,
Anyone bought a generator from generator sales (Central Maine Diesel)?
Just looking for some feedback:
1. about the company
2. gen set ... Kubota D1005 BG / Mecc-Alte NPE 32-B/4

thanks
david

[injin man]

I've had good luck buying parts from them. At one time
they sold complete Listeroids and some of their ads are still
out in cyberspace. This usually leads people to call them
and ask lots of questions that wastes their time. They seem
to know what they are doing though.

[mbryner]

I bought a lot of parts from them, too.   No problems other than the heavy stuff (spare Listeroid head, cylinder) started started breaking through the cardboard box it was packed in when delivered by UPS.

Marcus

[Henry W]

Hi,
Anyone bought a generator from generator sales (Central Maine Diesel)?
Just looking for some feedback:
1. about the company
2. gen set ... Kubota D1005 BG / Mecc-Alte NPE 32-B/4

thanks
david

Hi David,

I looked at the genset and I would have to say that it is overrated.

9,875 watts from a D1005BG running at 1800 rpm is way overloaded. I would not even attempt to run mine close to that. Where do people come up with these numbers?

Even the continuous rating of 8,750 watts is high.

It is safe to say that 6500 - 7000 watts max is a good continous rating for that engine to last.

Henry

[davidssfx]

Hi,
Anyone bought a generator from generator sales (Central Maine Diesel)?
Just looking for some feedback:
1. about the company
2. gen set ... Kubota D1005 BG / Mecc-Alte NPE 32-B/4

thanks
david

Hi David,

I looked at the genset and I would have to say that it is overrated.

9,875 watts from a D1005BG running at 1800 rpm is way overloaded. I would not even attempt to run mine close to that. Where do people come up with these numbers?

Even the continuous rating of 8,750 watts is high.

It is safe to say that 6500 - 7000 watts max is a good continous rating for that engine to last.

Henry

Thanks for the comments guys,

Also, Henry ...
Thanks for your evaluation of the gen set. I was wondering if this unit was over-loaded or if another gen set with the same engine was under-loaded.
There is a dealer in Western Canada that has a unit with a D1005 BG, and this is what they have it rated as ...
"6.5 kilowatts prime power output and 7.0 kilowatts intermittent or standby power output".

I don't know enough about generators to properly match the engine with the correct sized gen end, but there is quite a difference between the "Generator sales" rating compared with what you've said, as well as, the other gen set in Western Canada.
The D1005 BG is rated at ... Output, inter. 9.8 kWm (13.1 HP), Output, cont. 8.7 kWm (11.7 HP) ... but I don't know how this info relates to sizing the gen end?

What interested me in the Generator Sales unit is the engine and the price. Their unit is $5000 plus $500 shipping (total 5500), while the Western Canada unit (same engine) is $6900. A similar kW (6-7) unit in Alberta with a Yanmar mini max is $7100 plus $300 shipping.
So the $5000 unit is something to consider, but not if it is a poor engine/gen end match.
Guess the trick is finding a D1005 BG gen set with the correct sized gen end for $5000

Do you think the Mecc-Alte NPE 32 A/4 is a good match with the D1005 BG?
The other company matches it with a Newage/Stamford PI044D (Standard)

thanks again
david

[mbryner]

Guidelines:

Gen heads do best when not heavily loaded -- they run cooler.  Try to keep it around 50%.  A gen head that is oversized is not really less efficient when lightly loaded, but you pay more for it up-front.  

OTOH, a diesel generator has max efficiency when loaded down, i.e. running at 70%+.   You'll get less glazing of the cylinder wall, less coking, and an overall cleaner burn.

Rule of thumb:  1 hp of engine is about 500 watt of electrical output.

[Henry W]

Hi David,
I always go for a generator head that is larger than the engine is capable of running. Most generator heads are most effeciant below the max rating. The way to protect the engine from overloading is the proper size breaker. And with the D1005BG engine turning a gen head that is fused to 30 amps will protect from overloading.

I would think at that price it would have engine management protection so if the engine starts loosing RPM's the electricity will be disconnected to protect the generator head. If it does not come with that protection I would make sure it is put on.

Henry

[Henry W]

mbryner,

You beat me to it. You are correct.

Henry

[mbryner]

Learned everything from you guys!   

[davidssfx]

Guidelines:

Gen heads do best when not heavily loaded -- they run cooler.  Try to keep it around 50%.  A gen head that is oversized is not really less efficient when lightly loaded, but you pay more for it up-front.  

OTOH, a diesel generator has max efficiency when loaded down, i.e. running at 70%+.   You'll get less glazing of the cylinder wall, less coking, and an overall cleaner burn.

Rule of thumb:  1 hp of engine is about 500 watt of electrical output.

Thanks for the info mbryner
david

I'm looking at an APC UTS that has adaptive load management, since the main purpose will be emergency backup power. With the load management feature it should be possible to keep the engine running at a higher load (instead of just lights and small loads ... and when the well pump isn't being powered). Load shedding to protect the generator from overloading and loads kept in queue to keep the engine loaded. Sounds like a good idea anyway.
For some reason the 10 circuit model isn't available in Canada yet, not sure why.

[davidssfx]

Hi David,
I always go for a generator head that is larger than the engine is capable of running. Most generator heads are most effeciant below the max rating. The way to protect the engine from overloading is the proper size breaker. And with the D1005BG engine turning a gen head that is fused to 30 amps will protect from overloading.

I would think at that price it would have engine management protection so if the engine starts loosing RPM's the electricity will be disconnected to protect the generator head. If it does not come with that protection I would make sure it is put on.

Henry

Hi Henry,
thanks for taking the time to explain ... although I'm a little confused.
Are you saying that the Generator sales D1005 BG generator is OK ... since the gen end is larger than the engine is capable of, but that it should only be used at a max of 6 - 7 KW? And in order to protect the engine from carrying a larger load, an engine control should limit the load to a max of 30 A?
I'll ask Generator Sales about engine control (30 A).

david

just thinking ... I guess from a sales point of view it makes the unit more attractive to buyers by saying it can handle a larger load (more is better).
But realistically, it should only be used for a max 6-7 KW load. If run correctly (using your advice) maybe it is a decent matched unit?

[Henry W]

David,
It is good asking questions. Yes Generator sales D1005 BG generator is ok. Other generator manufactures are using a generator heads that an engine is not capable to operate at full output. The Mecc-Alte NPE 32-B/4 head should have a long life running a 6-7 KW load.

The NPE 32-B/4  overload ratings are as follows:
300% for 20 seconds
50% for 2 minutes
10% for 1 hour every 6 hours of operation.

Oh, I just realized something. I think the 9,875 watt rating is the max rating of the generator head, not the capable output of genset. Now the rating posted in the ad makes sense.

Another thing I found that is false on the ad. The D1005 BG engine does not have cast iron sleeves. But, these engines have a long life expectency, and they can be re-bored if needed.

Henry

[davidssfx]

David,
It is good asking questions. Yes Generator sales D1005 BG generator is ok. Other generator manufactures are using a generator heads that an engine is not capable to operate at full output. The Mecc-Alte NPE 32-B/4 head should have a long life running a 6-7 KW load.

The NPE 32-B/4  overload ratings are as follows:
300% for 20 seconds
50% for 2 minutes
10% for 1 hour every 6 hours of operation.

Oh, I just realized something. I think the 9,875 watt rating is the max rating of the generator head, not the capable output of genset. Now the rating posted in the ad makes sense.

Another thing I found that is false on the ad. The D1005 BG engine does not have cast iron sleeves. But, these engines have a long life expectency, and they can be re-bored if needed.

Henry

Hi Henry,
Thanks for your help with this ... much appreciated

david