Isuzu C201 question

[cohippy]

Hello everyone! i caught myself an entire thermo king refer unit, i scrapped everything but the engine, controls mounts, ect. hour meter says 3700 hours i know this refer was re-powered as it was a mid 1960's TK unit. the c201 has a production year on it of 1990. I have several questions i have not been able to find info or answers on. if anyone can help.....please do 1. I was thinking of getting either a 15kw or a 20 kw st gen head, ill be direct coupling, and running at 1850 rpm (yes 50 over to counter act for load) i cant find power curve chart for this engine, which gen head do you recommend?                                                                2. I've ran this engine with no load for 3 or 4 hours to run things through, i notice im only getting about 40psi on the oil gauge, whereas we have another c201 on a working refer unit installed that gets 65 psi, can anyone enlighten me here? do i need a new oil pump?             3. turbo or not to turbo? I have one laying around, but i just don't know if it would harm this bullet proof engine or not.                                                                                             4. the IP....i live at 4500 feet and will be using this genset at about 6500 feet, would turning up the fuel on this idi engine help a bit or just a waste of fuel?                                 anyways many thanks

[Ronmar]

Not specifically familliar with this engine, but in general low oil pessure has several possible causes:

Worn bearings allowing more oil to pass easilly resulting in lower pressure. 

Worn oil pump or leak on suction side of pump.

Stuck PRV/bypass valve if used.

It could also be an instrunment issue...

[cohippy]

i just bought a new oil pressure guage form HF this morning, when I get the forks back for the forklift, ill pull the engine out of storage and try it with this new guage, i think its the original guage, so im crossing my fingers to it being a malfunctioning guage, i might just be able to pull the guage while im waiting for the forks to come back and use the air compressor to see if its a lying guage or is accurate........

[admin]

40psi hot is more than adequate for that engine running at full load and rpm

i wouldn't get concerned until it gets down to around 25psi full load, full rpm and hot.

that might take another 5k hrs or more to get to that point, meantime you can enjoy lots of use out of it.

just keep it maintained with clean oil, fuel, air and coolant and it will run probably longer than you have need for it.

bob g

[DanG]

And the high PSI noted on the other unit may be the data in error...

[WStayton]

cohippy:

 The Isuzu C201 was one of the engines that I looked at before I settled upon the Mercedes 2.4 liter for my own ptoject.

 According to what I can find, the C201 is able  to make something like 70 ft lbs of torque at 1800 rpm which equates to about 24 horsepower. Since this HP is flat out, you might want to derate it slightly to get a continuous Hp rating of about 20 HP at 1800 rpm.  Depending on how many HP you think that it takes to get one kW, you can go from there.  A kW is equal to 1.34 horsepower, but there are some losses that you have to account for, so 1.5 HP per kW should be safe, giving you something like 13.3 kW.

 However, that is all based upon sea-level.  If you are at 6.000 ft. MSL, you should reduce that by about 12%, so at 6,000 ft you should be able to get about 11.73 kW +/-.

 As to turbocharging, I don't think there is a problem turnocharging, at 6,000 ft MSL, back to Sea-level performance but I would be very careful about going much farther than that, lest you create a whole new set of problems - particularly if you are anticipating using the engine as-is and not doing an overhaul before you proceed.  I think using the engine as-is, at a output of 12 kW, with a turbo and without doing an overhaul is relatively safe.  I definately swould NOT try to drive anything bigger than a 15 kW head, and realize that you may not be able to drive that to its full output.

 My opinions which are worth exactly what you paid for them!  <grin>

Regardz,

Wayne Stayton

[cohippy]

thank you wstayton that is some good info! i will have too look but a few lbs boost is all i was thinking would be necessary. Im looking at getting a rebuild kit  but thats anouther $600 and doesnt even come with cylinder sleeves if i need them. it starts EASY cut that doesent mean great compression, which i need to test. plus he gen head, lovejoy LC150 couplers plus a radiator ......with no rebuild $1500 out still, just my estimate.   i did look at the oil pressure guage it is the original or maybe newer, but its a TK guage. so i am wearry and will be checking it

[admin]

if it starts easily the compression is just fine

in nearly 40 years of being a hd diesel mechanic i can honestly say i never found a use for a compression gauge for any diesel
i ever worked on,, and i have worked on more than a few.

get yourself a service manual for this engine

what you may not know is the c201 by thermoking (built by isuzu) was used for both refer and generator use by thermoking

the only difference in the two applications is the refer ran at 1300 and 2300rpm, and the gensets were set to run at 1800rpm.

the fuel injection pump has an internal setting that requires a little jig/tool to set it for which use you want to use it for, if the engine
was originally setup as a refer unit then you will need to have the pump reset internally to the genset spec or it won't hold the load
stable and will have too much droop.

there are two different versions of this engine, the early and the later.  the later of course has some upgrades to all sorts of things that you
will likely want to know about.

the rebuild kits usually come with a higher capacity oil pump iirc.

if you want to turbo the little engine, i would check the blowby and make sure it is within spec's before adding boost. then i might change out
the rod and main brgs and upgrade the oil pump at the same time.

parts are really cheap for this engine, relatively speaking of course.

go to your local thermoking dealer and order the service manual, its worth every dime in my opinion.

bob g

[cohippy]

the fuel injection pump has an internal setting that requires a little jig/tool to set it for which use you want to use it for, if the engine
was originally setup as a refer unit then you will need to have the pump reset internally to the genset spec or it won't hold the load
stable and will have too much droop.

there are two different versions of this engine, the early and the later.  the later of course has some upgrades to all sorts of things that you
will likely want to know about.

i called our local isuzu, perkins, cat, cumins, ect they do it all.heres their link http://dieselservicesgj.com/divisions/industrial-engines/  anyways guy had no idea what i was tslking about, i called TK in denver only a 5 hour drive, thought i could get some help, they were pretty helpful on getting the service manual $25 but had no idea on this adjustment, told me to set the high throttle setscrew to what speed i needed and that would work. can i make this tool/jig? do you have any instructions on it?
thanks

[cohippy]

this is the rebuild kit i found http://www.thermobyproducts.com/Isuzu_C201_Engine_Kit_p/tb-37-10-271.htm but it dosent come in standard size.... starts at .010 over.... and no cylinder sleeves. i would prefer to stay std size and replace the sleeves if even needed than modify the engine... I found this place https://www.thermoenginesupply.com/ContentPages/InventorySelection.aspx?parentId=0&CatId=1000 too but the choices are better

[admin]

the pump setting procedure is well covered in the service manual, likely the techs have never repurposed a refer to a genset use
or visa versa, most of the guys that work are younger than these engine's and have no clue about setting them up.

i would think that you could make the little fixture/jig and get it setup right.

or take it to an injection pump shop and the pump guy will know how to set it up like you need it, just take the manual with you
to show him what is needed just in case he is not familiar with it.

bob g

[rl71459]

I have a genset that has the C201 TK Isuzu. Mine is a Reefer Engine. It is direct coupled to an ST-12 Genhead. Works Great! I use mine for backup and Alt fuel experimenting. Mine has not seen diesel in quite awhile.

My injecter pump is still set up for "Reefer use". It does not cause me any problems maybe it would be better if I had it set for "gen use" I dont know. I do have the book that shows how to change the setup for one or the other modes. Looks easy to do if you have the tools (I don't)

If need be I can dig it out for more info. I seem to recall the adverstised HP as 46, But do not recall @ what rpm. I do know it seems to not mind my fully loaded ST-12 even on my waste oil fuel.

Warning: I purchased the wrong book first, Due to misunderstanding of the TK Tech guy. I did get the one I needed eventually but ended up with both books in the end. I remember them as being expensive and they were not interested in swapping for the needed one. Make Sure they understand what you want!

Rob

P.S. When I first got started with my unit Mobil Bob gave me the much needed advice I lacked.
      Thank You Bob.

[cohippy]

rl71459 are u using WMO to run your c201? I bought myself a centerfuge and got my setup about 1/2 done.... (useable but not to the degree i want....) when testing my c201 i did use several alt fuels besides diesel, hydrolic oil, a quart of 30 weight non-detergent oil (unused) and a mix of diesel, the oil and hyreolic oil.... seemed to run fine on it all. i did notice some difficulity on the pump side with the thicker unheated oils, but that is to go without saying. i did get a bit od a haze using the alt fuels, bit i gont care about that i dont think....  have you looked at your injector tips after putting on some hours with the alt fuel? "My injecter pump is still set up for "Reefer use". It does not cause me any problems maybe it would be better if I had it set for "gen use" I dont know. I do have the book that shows how to change the setup for one or the other modes. Looks easy to do if you have the tools (I don't)" could you send me a copy of that page from ur book? if u have a scanner

[rl71459]

Hi CoHip

"rl71459 are u using WMO to run your c201?" The quick answer is no. But I have run it on WMO in earlier testing, As well as whatever I felt might work. I did what I call "viscosity compensation", This means that I attempted to approximately match the viscosity of diesel fuel via thinning using "RUG" (regular unleaded gas)

I most often use hydraulic oil, because I often have access to it. I will post the info about the pump adjustment's, I do think it is more than a page. I will dig out the books and find the proceedures in it, then post them.

Rob

[cohippy]

so i managed to find a radiator.... i hope its big enough.... its from a toyota with a r22 engine.....have electric fan for it might get another fan to do a push/pull setup plus since i have a 70 gallon fuel tank for my wmo, ill be using a coolent heat exchanger to heat the wmo. now here in the desert part of colorado we can see as high as 105 f does anyone know if this will be a big enough cooling system? thanks