186f 10hp diesels for sale on ebay. How?

[keith71]

I know this is a changfa type section. But this has had me wondering for a while.  The last 6-12 months these engines have over run ebay. If you do a search of smaller type diesel engines.  They are the air cooled 186 f Chinese clone of the Yanmar L100. They were sold in the U.S on generator setups under various name's until about 2011-2012 I think.      Then they were supposedly banned due to the EPA .                                                 
                                                                                                                                                                           
  Today these same engines can be purchased on Ebay from many different sellers in a few different states. Mainly they ship from California of all places   (Tree hugger capital of the world among various other lunatics). These engines have zero emission controls not even tier -1.5 ... Obviously they are coming by the container load. Can one of you guys help me understand how these supposed EPA illegal engines are getting into this country from china? But the Listeroid and some others are a big no-no. Thanks. Here are a few links..
                                                                                                                     
                    https://www.ebay.com/itm/124804229065?hash=item1d0ee967c9:g:oOIAAOSwMqtgyQMa       
                                                                                                                 
  https://www.ebay.com/itm/353643440365?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20200818142055%26meid%3Daac428c6bfbd4e9a82e7af42d0b9f594%26pid%                                                                                                                                  https://www.ebay.com/itm/403108385715?_trkparms=aid%3D1110013%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIMRXI%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20210708121852%26meid%3Dc2b18a35166541dca79b64a12a2fc741%26pid%3D101112%26rk%3D

[keith71]

Maybe the changfa's will be sold here again.

[Henry W]

Back around 2006 the Changfa water cooled diesels, including others could not be imported in the US anymore. There was a time that air cooled diesels up to 10 hp. were allowed to be imported for a while. My understanding is that some of the manufacturers were able to get certification for the air cooled diesels. And, getting engines certified takes deep pockets. It takes more than just passing emissions. The engines have to pass a durability testing also. I've heard, and I'm not sure if it's true, but I was told that it takes around $100,000.00 to have an engine go through certification processing and testing. This could be why we don't see many air cooled diesels on the market.

I've been watching those listings on EBay for some time. If they are doing something illegal it's only a matter of time that they will get caught.

The company's that are selling the engines have been doing it for some time. Why not call them or send them a message and see what response you get. I know some of us would be interested to hear their response.

About the Changfa water cooled and other clones. They are gone, and we won't see them come back.

A new Kubota EA330 single cylinder water cooled diesel is still available here in the US. And it's a wonderful engine. You will need about $3,200.00 or more to buy one. Or possibly get lucky and find a Kubota EA330, EA300, EB300, EL300 or, the rare EB200 on Craigslist or EBay for a fraction of a new one from a dealer.
There is always a possibility to find a good used one.
People have rebuilt a tired out one for around $500.00.

Henry

[Tom Reed]

Henry, if you check http://www.pelletmasters.com/products/index.html  they are selling pellet and hammer mills with the old style diesels.

[Henry W]

I just spoke to the person with pelletmasters directly and the reason they can get away selling those engines because it's purchased with a machine.

[mobile_bob]

now that is a interesting loophole
now all we need to do is design a "machine" that is useful for the most folks
and one that does not add much to the cost of the engine or shipping of an engine.

i wonder if a small belt driven generator qualifies as a "machine"?

or maybe a small wood chipper, like a home owner size thing for cleaning up around the yard?

sure makes me wonder how long before the epa closes that loophole, i am surprised it even exists.

bob g

[Tom Reed]

The 420 chipper is a reasonably nice machine. Especially if you want lots of nice sawdust. In fact is is a faithful copy of the John Deere 10A grain mill. I don't know why they bring the hopper style engines over. Talk about a whole bunch of opportunities for an employee to ruin an engine. A run it with out water or B leave water in it during a freeze. Perhaps they can import "replacement" engines?

[mobile_bob]

i would really like a copy of the epa regs that allow the import of so called "machines" that use the water cooled changfa types
most interesting would be the specific definition of what the EPA calls a "machine".

they may have a specific list of items that they term as machines, i am thinking maybe gensets are not what they call machines?
or someone would have been importing them by now.

bob g

[keith71]

I just spoke to the person with pelletmasters directly and the reason they can get away selling those engines because it's purchased with a machine.

I wonder what the excuse from the epa will be when someone needs to order a replacement engine for their "machine" pellet machine, rice machine etc etc, after they ran it low on oil or the coolant froze and cracked the block. It is not easy to find all these little exceptions to the laws just looking at the EPA website. Need someone on the inside with the true facts.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Listeroids I read can be imported into the U.S as an air compressor. Change a few parts over that are included in the box, and you have a running diesel engine. That is another thing I would like to know if it is fact or fiction.  Hope everybody has a good labor day weekend.

[Henry W]

A while back when I completed a Kubota genset build I tried purchasing an almost new Kubota B1005 parts engine that from a Kubota dealer and they could not sell it to me.  I was told that a person can purchase a replacement engine as long as the serial numbers of the engine match with the equipment it's on. And, the original engine has to be sent back to the manufacturer and documented. So it logical to believe that this same practice might have to be followed with other equipment manufacturers as well.

[Henry W]

I just spoke to the person with pelletmasters directly and the reason they can get away selling those engines because it's purchased with a machine.

I wonder what the excuse from the epa will be when someone needs to order a replacement engine for their "machine" pellet machine, rice machine etc etc, after they ran it low on oil or the coolant froze and cracked the block. It is not easy to find all these little exceptions to the laws just looking at the EPA website. Need someone on the inside with the true facts.

Ok, since none of us are not a 100% sure what the true facts are. Why don't you keep looking into it. Its easier now than it has been in the past. The EPA has a number. Give them a call. You will probably be shuffled around but persistence will pay off. Once you find out than let us know.

And, the 186F engines are available to purchase on Ebay. If you want one, than buy one. You are protected with PayPal if it's a scam.

[keith71]

now that is a interesting loophole
now all we need to do is design a "machine" that is useful for the most folks
and one that does not add much to the cost of the engine or shipping of an engine.

i wonder if a small belt driven generator qualifies as a "machine"?

or maybe a small wood chipper, like a home owner size thing for cleaning up around the yard?

sure makes me wonder how long before the epa closes that loophole, i am surprised it even exists.

bob g       

http://www.pelletmasters.com/HammerMill/index.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI4NWNrL-H9QIV4cmUCR0d9gC-EAAYASAAEgLLU_D_BwE                                           
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I contacted these guys and asked about replacement diesel engines for their pellet and hammermills. I said I bought one of their machines used a few years back and it needs a new diesel engine. The replacement engine would be a s195 or an s1100 engine. They said they do not carry replacement engines, but would gladly sell me a brand new mill for $5000. I said I need a simple engine to replace my blown up one. They could not help. Do not even stock basic parts. How the hell they have survived in chippewa falls wisconsin is beyond me. They are importing s195 and s1100 buy the container full but will not sell replacement engines. I guess if you buy one new and have a problem they may pull an engine off a showroom model or sell you a new complete machine. Great warranty strategy.

[Henry W]

When I spoke to pelletmasters back in September. They said they get many people calling and asking to buy just the engine. My understanding is they are pretty much tired of people asking about the engine only. I bet they heard everything under the sun. If they sold just the engine and got caught it would pretty much be the end of them. You can't blame them.

[veggie]

If you want a Changfa style engine Just buy a Pellet Mill and throw away the Mill.
It's probably still cheaper than ordering an engine from China and paying the freight, duty, brokerage, etc.. etc..   

[Henry W]

If you dont want to go through all that expense and trouble. Just buy one of the New Kubota Z482 diesels that include an SAE flywheel and housing listed on Ebay. Those engines have been known to last for 20,000 plus hours, and, they are rebuildable. You can make, or even buy quite a genset for $5,000.00

A matter of fact, you would be able to buy a lifetime supply of 186F engines. And before putting any in service, tear it apart and blueprint it.

Henry