I hacked together a cooling system and hooked the generator head up to my Metro 6/1.
I used to have to start it with one squirt of ether but it starts right up easy now.
The wooden base is much better than the pallet it was shipped on, seems pretty smooth.
My mounting of the ST-5 leaves much to be desired, I need to come up with a better scheme.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zG2H1p34Rgs
-Jedon
You may want to move that radiator closer to the engine and reduce the length of those pipes. They appear to be unsupported and will probably break the bolts off the flanges over time.
Carl
The radiator is resting on that rolling work table right now, I am planning on hanging a frame off the rafters to hold it in place. Do you think the metal pipes alone are too heavy? I have some left over PEX from the house plumbing, can that handle the heat instead of the galvi pipe? I didn't want the radiator right over the ST-5 in case of water leaks.
I would get some automotive heater hose in there to keep the vibrations out of the radiator. I'm sure you are getting some vibration transfered to the radiator and with time you will have a leak for sure! IMO..........
Dave
So I should just use automotive heater hose for the hole thing and ditch the steel pipe altogether?
Hey same unit as mine!
How did you ever get the fuel line and filter to stop leaking?
I made a new banjo fitting and used a filter I had.
You can see if you want.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vbvzzYZfL8
Got to start somewhere,, and if its cooling ,, it works..
I will tell you this from my mistakes.. All 3 of my Lister's are mounted on heavy I-beam,, or channel iron frames with the radiator mounts welded to the main frame,, as an upright. Well no matter how much iron,, there is a constant shaking going on that works on the old car radiators I'm using.
My plans are is to make a self supporting stand alone radiator stand,, and allow the rubber coolant hoses to cancel the engine vibes to add some life to the radiator cores..
Sure glad a few true Lister nuts went to the effort to get this all set up for us..
Sodbust
I thought the radiator pipes would dampen enough vibration, not like the car it was from was pampered!
Hehe I'll put in a concrete base eventually, just didn't have the time to do it for this year.
Quote from: Jedon on September 21, 2009, 03:42:10 PM
The radiator is resting on that rolling work table right now, I am planning on hanging a frame off the rafters to hold it in place. Do you think the metal pipes alone are too heavy? I have some left over PEX from the house plumbing, can that handle the heat instead of the galvi pipe? I didn't want the radiator right over the ST-5 in case of water leaks.
Pex can take the heat, but do you have a large enough diameter?
billswan
Having had some experience with 6-1s breaking things--
If the engine moves at all, take all the weight you can from all the mounting flanges and try to mount nothing but flexible tubing to the head. If the engine is mounted to ground and doesn't move, solid pipes can be fixed to the head and it won't hurt anything. Think of the leverage applied to the mounting flanges and the brittle nature of cast iron and govern accordingly.
The low pressure fuel line should always be flexible or have a flexible section in it. I like remote fuel tanks and cooling units and let the engine work alone instead of having (breakable) things hanging off of it.
Cooling schemes fascinate me and I about wore out a high dollar IR gun testing several of them on several engines over three years. I found that it takes large tubing or pipes and short, steep runs to best run the thermo-siphon. More complicated runs and small tubes can work, but circulation seems to be in surges instead of a steady rate. A water hammer caused by a tripping thermostat shooting hot water in a small line can break a connection and let the engine go dry.
I've used two inch diameter pipe and hose for the upper (exit) fitting up to six feet long and thirty inches of rise with no problems.
Cool place to hang out, this is. Thanks for the invite.
Quote from: XYZER on September 21, 2009, 04:10:45 PM
I would get some automotive heater hose in there to keep the vibrations out of the radiator. I'm sure you are getting some vibration transfered to the radiator and with time you will have a leak for sure! IMO..........
Dave
I have tried a couple of variations but on long pieces of pipe I used a hose on either end to prevent vibration transfer and the leverage exerted from long pipes.
The reason I used pipes was that long pieces of hose had a tendency to bend and have a low spot that interfered with circulation. Later I tried using just hose and wire tied a piece of 1x2 wood on the underside of the hose to keep it straight. I have been using that for a couple of years now with no problems.
Quote from: Magic Jack on September 21, 2009, 08:49:35 PM
Having had some experience with 6-1s breaking things--
If the engine moves at all, take all the weight you can from all the mounting flanges and try to mount nothing but flexible tubing to the head. If the engine is mounted to ground and doesn't move, solid pipes can be fixed to the head and it won't hurt anything. Think of the leverage applied to the mounting flanges and the brittle nature of cast iron and govern accordingly.
I was really lucky in that my engine didn't try to crawl out the door running on the floor. In fact a glass of water didn't even splash or fall off the valve cover. Even so, there is still a lot of vibration. I could feel it inside the house.
I read about 1 ton concrete slabs and all that but I tried something unconventional. I buried 2 RR ties with the top level with the ground. Then I bolted the engine, st head and pony engine all to 2 4x4's and lagged the 4x4's to the RR ties. No vibration anywhere. Not even rite next to it. It's been there for three years now
WGB: I haven't really run it enough to find leaks, I'll keep an eye on that, thanks!
I just got 8ft of 1" heater hose and will use that instead of most of the 1" steel pipe.
My Metro has a water pump so although that's one more thing to break it does make cooling easier.
I got a water temp gauge and will install that along with the heater hose soon. I still need that thermostat housing flange and an exhaust vibration isolator.
Where do people get hour meters so I know when to do maintenance?
Sodbust and Majic Jack...
Good to find you guys over here. I wondered what happened to ya.
I concur with the keeping the rad seperate from the engine using hoses. Just be sure that they are large enough to allow for proper flow.
Ken Gardner
I got 8ft of 1" heater hose to replace most of the steel pipe.
I'll get the thermostat flange extender from George, do I need a bypass loop if I do it that way?
Hour Meter: http://cgi.ebay.com/Hour-Meter-operates-on-120-Volts-AC_W0QQitemZ180346335443QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item29fd7ab0d3&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
Quote from: Sodbust on September 21, 2009, 05:29:58 PM
Got to start somewhere,, and if its cooling ,, it works..
I will tell you this from my mistakes.. All 3 of my Lister's are mounted on heavy I-beam,, or channel iron frames with the radiator mounts welded to the main frame,, as an upright. Well no matter how much iron,, there is a constant shaking going on that works on the old car radiators I'm using.
My plans are is to make a self supporting stand alone radiator stand,, and allow the rubber coolant hoses to cancel the engine vibes to add some life to the radiator cores..
Sure glad a few true Lister nuts went to the effort to get this all set up for us..
Sodbust
You mean like this??
(http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk298/trapperjohn1441/Lister/DSC01698.jpg)
(http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk298/trapperjohn1441/Lister/DSC01700.jpg)
I found a wheel mounted display rack, nice and heavy duty, put the fuel there and the Fan and Radiator and use the Rubber hoses to cancel out the harsh vibrations.. sits nice and smooth and I can direct heat to the fuel in the winter to warm it up at -30C
BTW the new fuel system I have is great, no loss of prime, nice and tight, no spill or leaks and the flow is great for starting
Ahhh you mounted your ST-5 on the exhaust side, probably a better idea but doesn't work well with my shed configuration. I think I'm going to mount the radiator on the 2x6 studs on the wall and put a couple small 12v fans back there powered by a computer power supply.
I haven't gotten into the fuel supply issue yet, I imagine that will become pressing after I get it running well.
Well I got the radiator hooked up with 1" heater hose which works much better than the 4/3" steel pipe. I ran wire from the ST-5 to to a breaker box with two 50A breakers and from there to the AC inputs on my two Xantrex 5548's. The good news is it works! I set it for 15A from each pole so about 3600W and it was charging the batteries for about 2 minutes before the shaking vibrated the belt off the ST-5. The whole setup had moved a couple feet, wanted to go for a walk I guess. Soooo I guess the idea of mounting on 6x8's for now didn't really work out, I will pour concrete for it in spring but right now just want to get it up and running. I was thinking of drilling through the 6x8's and the 4" concrete slab and pounding some large rebar 4' down to hold it in place? Any suggestions?
How much deflection should I have on the belt from the engine to the generator head?
Thanks!
-Jedon
PS I'll take pics and video this evening.
When I was working on the foundation for my house I drilled holes in the footings, dropped all thread in the hole and then used epoxy on it. Would the same thing work for the Lister mount? What are the anchors you speak of?
Thanks!!
-Jedon
aha like this? http://www.amazon.com/Down-Engineering-59124L-Concrete-Anchor/dp/B000LNYX36
Okay I got 6 "redheads" as the hardware store called them and a 4ft section of 1/2" allthread along with 12 washers, 6 nuts and 6 lock washers.
Now I seem to have some decisions to make and I could really use some sage advice.
1. Bolt the engine right to the floor, no other metal or wood or anything
2. Leave the engine on it's wooden + angle iron mount and bolt the whole thing to the floor.
3. #2 but keep the rubber cow mat between the wood mount and the floor.
4. Make a new I beam mount and bolt that to the floor.
5. Pour a concrete block on top of the slab ( rebarred to the existing slab ).
6. Jackhammer out a section of the slab and pour a block the right way.
Option 2 or 3 is easiest since I already have the ST-5 mounted ( ish, needs work ).
I don't have much time or money right now and winter is coming so those are factors!
Thanks!!
-Jedon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dyI96D1e5o
Good to know about the redhead anchors!
What would be the advantage of making a rim around the frame instead of just bolting all the way through the 6x8's and rubber mat?
You might want to consider 3 inch deep seismic anchors. I just finished building the new Operations Center for the CF and we had to make sure it would survive an earthquake... yeah in Ottawa on the Canadian Shield no less.
Anyways We had used the drop in types that opened up. The Engineer we hired said they were great for a steady state load, but one that was moving (vibrating) would tear them out. The bolts we ended up using are tested to hold during horizontal and vertical stresses. I believe they are $9 Cdn each.. but sure work great Just ask to make sure they meet US seismic standards... Canada does not have any, but we are adopting US standards in 2010
cheers
andrew
Been gone for some time.. so a little late getting back.
Yes,, that is how all my radiators are mounted,, but with heaver angle iron or sq tubing.
So how stable is your set up?
Sodbust
Well. Hello from Tennessee, Magic Jack. Hope you got everything dried in in time for winter!
Ron